Use Allparts HB bobbins? There's been a change.

[WolfeMacleod]

Be aware that the bobbins have recently changed. the mold may have been retooled... I don't know.
New bobbins are not identical to older bobbins. Square hole has been relocated, not as nicely formed. Bottom square lead-out hole is also relocated further from the flange.
Texture/finish on top of new bobbins is different.
Crush-point use to lock in pole slugs in slug-side bobbin is much smaller.. slugs loose.
Three half-holes (material weight relief I guess) that don't go all the way through bobbin have been increased in size and relocated.
Pronounced ridge of material around polepiece holes and bobbin mounting screw holes.

Can't use them in conjunction with older stock. _well, you could, if you don't mind having mis-matched parts!)


These are just the things I noticed immediately upon picking one up. I noticed something was different because the weight was lighter when I picked it up.

These bobbins suck by comparison to the older bobbins.


StewMac has the same new bobbins.

[Zhangliqun]

I noticed that a couple months ago, and yes, Stewmac bobbins are sadly the same, just found that out yesterday. The black ones anyway, I don't know about the cream ones yet, hopefully they're not the same crappy tannish shade the Stewmac cream bobbins have always been. Have some one order, from Allparts, I'll find out the hard way soon. The material seems to be a smidge softer which could be a plus on bridge pickups but maybe a minus on the neck.

[WolfeMacleod]

I noticed that a couple months ago, and yes, Stewmac bobbins are sadly the same, just found that out yesterday. The black ones anyway, I don't know about the cream ones yet, hopefully they're not the same crappy tannish shade the Stewmac cream bobbins have always been. Have some one order, from Allparts, I'll find out the hard way soon. The material seems to be a smidge softer which could be a plus on bridge pickups but maybe a minus on the neck.

The cream will undoubtedly be the same, since they come from the same mold. On the old bobbins, there's always been a very tiny ding in the plastic on the bottom, where the mold was dinged... on the screw-side bobbin, next to a bobbin-mounting screw hole.
Ever since they changed from the pinkish cream around 2006 or 07, I've been pretty happy with the cream shade.

[Zhangliqun]

Good News

Just got a reply to my email to Allparts on these new bobbins:

We just discovered that ourselves yesterday. I have contacted the factory and they said they are using a new mold, but can still ship product to us from the old mold. We have specified only old mold bobbins and should see them in about 6 weeks.

We'll just have to hang in there til late April or so.

[Zhangliqun]

Just got a shipment of zebra sets today. The black (screw) coils are new mold, the cream slug coils are old mold.

[WolfeMacleod]

Here's a little update.

If anyone would be interested on co-opping a mold that replicates the old bobbin exactly (or with a couple minor improvements such as a reduction of knit lines) I have a line on the company who does the molding for Seymour, PRS, Fender, and several others.
That bobbin could be shot in Butyrate, High Impact Polystyrene (same as the Allparts bobbins) or ABS, or Polycarbonate. In any color you wanted... black, cream, white, clear...
Each person in the co-op would be able to contact the injection company directly, and order whatever they need. Projected cost is about 40 cents each, depending on volume.

[big_teee]

Here's a little update.

If anyone would be interested on co-opping a mold that replicates the old bobbin exactly (or with a couple minor improvements such as a reduction of knit lines) I have a line on the company who does the molding for Seymour, PRS, Fender, and several others.
That bobbin could be shot in Butyrate, High Impact Polystyrene (same as the Allparts bobbins) or ABS, or Polycarbonate. In any color you wanted... black, cream, white, clear...
Each person in the co-op would be able to contact the injection company directly, and order whatever they need. Projected cost is about 40 cents each, depending on volume.

Can you clue us in what the initial expense would cost, to be in the Co-op?
Telling us here would head off a lot of PMs.
Thanks,
T

[WolfeMacleod]

Can you clue us in what the initial expense would cost, to be in the Co-op?
Telling us here would head off a lot of PMs.
Thanks,
T

The mold has been quoted between $20-22,000. Four people would be around $5-5500 each. Five people would be about $4400 each, if it were $22,000.
Mold would produce a million parts or more. It would last all of us a lifetime.

Keiyo in Japan went out of business. The old mold now belongs to a new company, who has no interests in maintaining it, so they just made a new mold...poorly.

I've spoken with Arcane. He'll run his numbers.
I think I can get Voodoo interested, as he uses the same part. He considering buying them from me, but he'd probably be more interested in co-opping and paying a lower cost per part in preferred materials.
Van Zandt as well, as I spoke with them a few days ago. (they had a mold.. company went out of business, mold vanished. Now they're using Allparts bobbins as well)

There is another option for a mold from a different company, but I haven't received the quote yet. I'm unsure about their capabilities. However, the company I'm heavily considering has a lot of experience with these parts, they know the stuff inside an out.

[big_teee]

It sounds like something that might work, for sure.
Here's some questions some might want answered.
Q. This would be a 49.2mm authentic PAF type bobbin mold, and it could be used to make bobbins of different materials, one mold for screw bobbin, and one for slug?
Q. The mold would be in the possession of the Machining company making the bobbins, but the mold would belong to the co-op group?
Q. Would this project be supervised, or overseen by Wolfe Macleod?
Q Any kind of Receipt, or declaration of ownership for Co-op members?
Others might have additional questions?
Thanks,
T

[WolfeMacleod]

It sounds like something that might work, for sure.
Here's some questions some might want answered.
Q. This would be a 49.2mm authentic PAF type bobbin mold, and it could be used to make bobbins of different materials, one mold for screw bobbin, and one for slug?

It could be adjusted to 49.2mm. The Allparts bobbin is technically 49.53mm, but fits 49.2mm stuff just fine. The difference is about 12 thousandths. The point isn't to replicate a PAF bobbin to the exact detail, it's to replace a very fine bobbin that will be NLA soon. The point is to replicate the Allparts bobbins, which is a nice looking, nicely dimensioned, cleanly molded part. No ugly gaps between coils when mounted. The slug-side holes should be reduced in diameter ever-so-slightly for a 3/16th slug. Allparts bobbins are slightly oversized for that hole diameter.


Q. The mold would be in the possession of the Machining company making the bobbins, but the mold would belong to the co-op group?

Yes, it would be in possession of the molding company in California The mold would be proprietary to the co-op group.

Q. Would this project be supervised, or overseen by Wolfe Macleod?

I'm not sure I would state it that way, but if you insist.

Q Any kind of Receipt, or declaration of ownership for Co-op members?

Of course, and I've already spoken with the molding company. Anyone from the co-op would be able to order at any time. Everyone is listed as a mold owner.


Others might have additional questions?
Thanks,
T

To answer another question that may pop up from someone, the molding company is able to do a mold with an interchangeable TOP flange. This means that surface finishes could be different... we could have a satin finish, a shiny polished finish, etc. This would undoubtedly cost more, but if one user wanted X finish and the other user wanted Y finish, that can be done.


3D ERPT files can be downloaded here and viewed on online 3D viewers: Index of /bobbins

[WolfeMacleod]

Update

New quote given by California company.

$13,000. Mold made in China, injection done in California. Mold owners would be welcome to view production, cycle times, materials cost, etc. California company has the utmost confidence that moldmaker can reproduce that bobbin. Complete transparency.

They can convert to 49.2mm spacing.

An alternate top finish piece can be added for $2-3,000, so different surface finishes can be achieved for different users.

[Zhangliqun]

Can't contribute much to the mold but would sure be interested in the product.

[rjb]

Comment from the Peanut Gallery

That bobbin could be shot in Butyrate, High Impact Polystyrene (same as the Allparts bobbins) or ABS, or Polycarbonate. In any color you wanted... black, cream, white, clear...

Make some to match the color and finish of Gibson's gold speed knobs, and the world will beat a path to your door.
Trust me, I just have a feeling.

[WolfeMacleod]

Make some to match the color and finish of Gibson's gold speed knobs, and the world will beat a path to your door.
Trust me, I just have a feeling.

Any color. That could be done.

Turns out, those bobbins are ABS, and not HIPS as I had been told years ago.

I'll be co-opping with Stew-Mac and another winder.
The company says they can guarantee MUCH less knit/flow lines between polepeice holes, and less "sinkage" between poles, as well. Knit lines should be invisible.


Next up will be a GOOD F-spaced or 7-string part. I would assume mold price will be about the same.

[salvarsan]

bump