Filling up wire space with a spacer, to make a fatter coil

[achase4u]

I only know about SC pickups so I am not sure if this has already been done or not.

but folks talk about the sonic change using 43 gauge to make lets say a 6k pickup, vs a 6k 42 gauge pickup. the coil of 43 is smaller.

well what if you just taped around the magnets enough to build up layers, and then started winding with 43 gauge, thus making a 43g 6k coil the same "size" as a 42g. would you end up with generally the same sound? or would it be something totally different?

Just pondering. been up too long and Im tired...

[Dave Kerr]

In a similar vein, I've added 1/8" thick wooden shims to one coil of blade humbuckers and cut down on the number of turns in the fatter side by about 1/2. Sounded good, and hum-free, though I didn;t do an A/B against a shim-less version.

[corduroyew]

I only know about SC pickups so I am not sure if this has already been done or not.

but folks talk about the sonic change using 43 gauge to make lets say a 6k pickup, vs a 6k 42 gauge pickup. the coil of 43 is smaller.

well what if you just taped around the magnets enough to build up layers, and then started winding with 43 gauge, thus making a 43g 6k coil the same "size" as a 42g. would you end up with generally the same sound? or would it be something totally different?

Just pondering. been up too long and Im tired...

It won't sound the same. 43awg wire filters off bass and boosts treble. By adding a spacer you will stop it from boosting the trebble but you won't stop it from filtering bass.

[black_labb]

i thought that 42 let more treble through, but was a fatter coil because of the size of the wire. i may be wrong though.

[David Schwab]

i thought that 42 let more treble through, but was a fatter coil because of the size of the wire. i may be wrong though.

It does, but 43 will wind a brighter coil unless you fill up the bobbin, and then the higher resistance will kill the top end. But the higher resistance also limits the low end a bit.

I like to wind neck pickups with 42 and bridge pickups with 43, winding the bridge hotter. That's for bass pickups anyway.

If you wind with heavier wire, like 40, you will get a very bright tone, with a lot of low end, but not as much output.

[black_labb]

ahh, sorry. i thought he was talking about the wire exclusively, where he was talking about the result of the coil's size. makes sense.

[corduroyew]

ahh, sorry. i thought he was talking about the wire exclusively, where he was talking about the result of the coil's size. makes sense.

actually, it's the coil size that makes the 43awg brighter to begin with. 43awg wire filters more high end and low end than 42awg wire but 43awg wire lets you have more windings closer to the magnet. The closer the windings are to the magnet the brighter your tone will be. The high end added because you are closer to the coil is greater than the high end lost due to the smaller wire. Adding a spacer and moving the windings further away from the magnets gets rid of your added high end.

[Meowy]

Then I would think you could have the same type of effect with slug poles vs screw poles. Since screw poles are a smaller diameter there would be more space (i.e. bobbin material) between the pole and the start of the coil as compared to larger diameter slugs

Of course you also have an additional variable of pole (core) mass that comes into the picture

[Zhangliqun]

The polepieces extend the magnetic field below the baseplate and thus dilute it some. Shortening the pole pieces will increase the output and give you more upper mid grind.

[David King]

The pedal steel pickups often have an "air gap" to kill off the highs. I suspect that layers of tape or wood or anything else will result in much the same thing.

[Scott S.]

David,

Which brand pedal steel pickups are you referring to, I have rewound a couple and not seen that yet.

[David King]

Scott, it was a local guy around here by the name of Dan Shields, he passed away a few years back but I have a couple of his 10 string pickups sitting in a box in the attic. I remember him saying .015" was the good number but he might have been talking about the distance between the magnets and the slugs, not the coil and the slugs.

[Scott S.]

I believe he designed the pickup for ZB pedal steels, as well as a design used by Sierra, he was very well known in the steel world.

Both of these use two rows of magnets/polepieces (not sure which) outboard of the coil, and a center row of adjustable polepieces, a very interesting design. I have measured a pickup from a ZB, but could not disassemble it, and they measure quite differently from a typical pole piece type steel pickup as far the the R, L, and Q readings.