Tell me I got a good deal?

[RedHouse]

I got a 9-lb spool of Essex 42-gauge "SOLDERON" off eBay for $103.00, is that a good deal?

[Mark Hammer]

Yes and no. I can't speak to the wire quality, but in terms of the number of coils that can be wound from that spool, it is clearly the equivalent of well over $1000 in pickups. So its a bargain in that sense.

On the other hand, working with spools that big can be problematic. Where 1/4lb spools can be made to turn on a base without tearing the wire, with a spool that big, you either have to construct some sort of mechanism that turns the spool to release the wire for you, let the spool sit stationary and unwind from the spool using something that allows you to use a conventional winder, or else transfer from the big spol to individual smaller ones to set up for winding with a coil winder. So, as wire-per-$, bargain, as headache-per-$, not.

I've been winding for a while from the same hulking spool of #41, and can offer the following info. I sit the spool on the ground, as low down from the actual winding device as I can. Why? Because that reduces the sharpness of the angle the wire has to run at as it passes over the edge of the spool-end and up to the coil. I hand-wind my coils with a hand drill clamped to the bench. The coil is attached to the chuck and looks like a propellor on a plane as I turn the handle. I suppose I *could* make a mechanized motor-driven winder, but for the number of pickups I make in a year, it ain't worth it. Besides, the tension produced by using such a large spool (it was at least 5lbs to start) means that I can't run the winding that fast without risking breakage. If I have to do it that slowly (and "slowly" means that it takes a half hour to wind a standard Strat-type coil), may as well do it simply with a hand-drill. This way, I can sense the shift in wire tension with my finger tips and slow down the winding until the wire coming off the spool is once again near the middle of the spool rather than close to the ends where the "angle-of-departure" over the spool ends is so sharp and dangerous. Keep in mind that a spool that big likely has ends that are at least 5-6" wide. Certainly the wire will slip off the ends as easily as anywhere else on the spool when the spool is "fresh" and the wire is wound on the spool right out to the perimeter of the spool ends. But as you start to use up more and more of the wire, the wire near the spool ends won't slip off over the ends quite so easily. You'll need to watch it. There is the very real possibility that you might not get to use all 9lbs of it, but even so...that's a lotta wire!

[RedHouse]

...clearly the equivalent of well over $1000 in pickups.

So that would be like 3 sets of "Timbuckers" then?

Thanks for replying Mark, yours is a familiar name from over on Aron's Stomp Box Forum.

[RedHouse]

Landed another for $110, geez I'm in the rewinding biz now!

[Possum]

maybe

its not that great a deal you saved maybe 40-50 bucks per spool. Anything helps I guess. Soderon has its uses, good for some stuff not good for others....

[RedHouse]

its not that great a deal you saved maybe 40-50 bucks per spool. Anything helps I guess. Soderon has its uses, good for some stuff not good for others....

Ahh, you must have been one of those 15 bidding against me.

Anyway, don't know about you, but over here at my place 40-50 bucks is in fact $40-$50 I can spend on other parts for my other ventures.

Sheesh, $40-$50 bucks, that reminds me of an interview I read years ago with Leo Fender....

...he (Leo) was eating his lunch in the cafeteria and some employees of his asked him why he packed his own (brown-bag) lunch everyday, why didn't he buy his lunch since he was obviusly successful enough to afford to.

His reply was this: "see for the price of that sandwich you bought, I could buy a handfull of capacitors, and for the price of that drink another handfull of resistors ...I pack my lunch because I like to apply financing where most appropriate..."

Anyway Possum, I guess it was a loaded question, sorry. I was mostly pique'ing the interest of those here who look regularly for wire, and there it was on eBay up for grabs, three 9.5-lb spools.
(BTW; a CUB4 and CUB5 went for under $30 just this week, need a counter for your winding machine?)

Yeah, I've been in contact with Superior/Essex (Dave Hopt and Mike Sattison) and a 9-lb spool is sold for WAY more than $103 (yep like nearly x3...but you need a minimum order too!) so anyway that 40-50 bucks thing well it's a little shy doncha think?
(oh but Stew-Mac sells a 1/2-lb spool for $25, hmmm 18 1/2lb's x $25 = $450)

MarkH may have hit on to something new to me, prior to this I have only used 3-lb spools on my winder, which are much smaller, I will indeed need to be highly observant when it comes to these big-'ol-spools

(YEAH BABY!)

[NightWinder]

Ahh, 42 sbp(Solderon) = $18.00 per lb X 9 lbs = $162.00 . Thats really not that great of a deal. So you saved $59.00? The more you buy (Lbs),the cheaper it is. You may have got that directly from Essex for 6-9$ less buying 10 Lbs, which would put you right where you are at now, oh, not including shipping. Now your plagued with the shitty sound of Solderon. There is a definate place for it, but you must manipulate your material for it to perform properly, and actually sound ok, if that. One mans trash is anothers treasure!!
That would actually be good, if say you were uping your production, and had to teach someone how to make pickups, control and manipulate the coil shape, tension, etc. That way you would'nt loose too much money when things get messy. It sure is a hell of alot cheaper that P.E, and H.F,,,,and Polysol for that matter. Honestly, it has its purpose, but for that gauge you limited too.
Good luck, BTW, what do you plan on doing with it? What type of character are you demanding from your pickups?

[EtLa]

I saw the auction and it was a Heavy Build Soderon Essex magnet wire spool.

[Possum]

uh oh

If you got heavy build you're going to get a totally different tone than you're expecting. Heavy build is low capacitance and anything you wind is going to be bright and chimey.

No I didn't bid on it, I don't use much soderon, though I do on a few things. I did score some heavy formvar, about 20lbs before the guy figured out it was expensive stuff, I did save some money and got as much as I could before he jacked the price up. I don't use alot of that either but its useful to have and is expensive too. Jeez if you got 18lbs of heavy build 42 thats an awful lot of wire that basically does one thing well.....

[EtLa]

If it's this auction...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...ME:B:WNA:US:12

on the tag there is a H that I think it's for Heavy. On my essex spool it's an S

[RedHouse]

...Heavy build is low capacitance and anything you wind is going to be bright and chimey...

Exactly! nothing worse that winding a dull pickup.

I've been wanting some heavy build after reading some posts by Jason over on the old forum. I have plenty of single build 42 and 43.

[Possum]

:-)

as long as you know that, its impossible to get a warm tone from that wire, plus that stuff is usually about .0030-.0031" thick so you can't get alot of it on a bobbin. that spool will probably last your lifetime :-) Its also good for tying up boats to docks, pretty sturdy stuff. The spools make good lamp bases too :-) anyway yeah you got a good buy. I got a ten pound spool of 40 heavy (yes the H means heavy) off ebay, I think I wound one pickup with it so far, it was too bright to be useable, looks good on the shelf though :-) YaaaaY its FRIDAY!!!!!!

[ken]

You know, if you were to donate those spools to any member of this group, you probably wouldn't hear any complaints at all. Me, I would use it, maybe you might find some interesting tone with it nobody else has. Or, use it for 'practice' so you don't use 'good' wire while experimenting with new pickup models.

Ken

[NightWinder]

Hopefully, he gets the tone he wants out of it, decide on a model of a pickup, and sell it! Get some cash back. Honest replys and opinions are a nice thing here, especially from guys that know whats what. I would'nt refer to it as "complaints", but mearly opinions from some that have been there. I certainly hope Redhouse does find a use for it, I think we all have lost money here and there ordering things that get to your shop, and are totallly not what you thought it was. Thats a Dirty Birdy!!
I personally would'nt take it for free. I have no use for it, and someone else would.

[RedHouse]

You know, if you were to donate those spools to any member of this group, you probably wouldn't hear any complaints at all....

That's no shit Ken! I should have labeled my subject line
"tell me I got robbed" but the new PMF seems to be crap, sorry to see the old one go! I used love to hang our here for going on 5 years now.
(damn TBoy, classic case of fixing something that wasn't broken)

For a moment, as I read Dave's replys with very little interest untill I did a search on him in the old forum to remind me he's been kind of an ass all along (now that I look at his posts) well except this:

"you just have to try it all yourself because what you get and some other guy gets aren't going to be the same, it really IS the craftsman's touch that has alot to do with tone

Hmm, why you being such an arse Dave? been having trouble selling pickups or something?


Nightwinder, "been there"? I've been here years, way before the likes of you, what you talkin 'bout newby?

Ahh, never mind, this place blows anymore, I'm so outa here.