Cast magnets

[David Schwab]

So if true...it would appear cast magnets are available, just wish I could find where to get them.

I did a quick search on Google for "cast alnico magnet" and got some results... here's the first few:

Bunting Magnetics Co. - Cast Alnico & Sintered Alnico Magnets

Sintered and Cast AlNiCo Magnet

China Cast Alnico Magnet,Cast Alnico Magnets Manufacturer, Supplier, Factory, Exporter in china

Looks like they are available.

[Matt T.]

Thanks David but I didn't see any in the right size. I'm not a maker, just a tinkerer and only need a few. I'd like to try A8 too but going from the difference between A2 and A5 and extrapolating from that ...I might not like it.

I used to have a pair of 8K/9K Fralin Unbuckers with (allegedly) A4 magnets and I didn't particularly care for them. They were just the opposite of what I expected, reduced clarity and a rather ass-less low end.

[Possum]

cast....

Where did you hear that about Fralin? Yes of course alot of alnico is cast, but they are cast as big blocks of material then cut up. The difference between that and old stuff is the old stuff was done as small long pieces that were cut up, so the wide flat sides are rough. In modern times this stuff is cast in gas atmosphere to keep oxygen out etc. Big difference than the old way. This cryo stuff is bunk, it supposedly makes some tiny difference, sure as hell they weren't dunking alnico magnets into liquid nitrogen back in the 50s. Alnico 4 makes nice neck buckers if done right, here's a sample of a set with A2 in bridge and A4 in the neck:
http://www.sdpickups.com/audio/tone%20king%20dirty.mp3
You either like it or you don't, for me A4 has a little more definition than A2, doesn't work in bridge pickups too well for me.

[Possum]

ooops....

forgot to mention that in the sound clip the last sample is the neck with A4, guitar is an LP clone, amp is blackfaced vibrolux.....

[Matt T.]

Possum,
I can't find the 'cast' part now. I thought I saw it on the RS guitarworks description but it's not there anymore.

FWIW, the A5 magnets that were in the BB Pros that came in my '03 LP Standard had the rough, black surfaces.

[David Schwab]

Thanks David but I didn't see any in the right size...

yeah I have no idea who these people even are... but it seems makers still make cast magnets.

... a rather ass-less low end.

That's funny! I'll have to remember that one.

[Mark Hammer]

Where does the magic lie?

I was fortunate enough to catch the Allman Brothers around the time those videos were taken. I enjoyed Duane's playing (and yeah, our band at the time covered "Somebody Loan Me a Dime" largely *because* of Duane's solo on it), though more because he had a really good sense of how and when to go for those high notes (as he did on Derek and the Dominoes), than because of anything terribly unique or sublime about his tone. There are a lot of wonderful things that happen when you hold your pick just the right way and hit the strings just the right way, with a guitar that feels just right, and a respectable amp turned up loud. I strongly doubt that there is any single technical component of that which assures something memorable or distinctive, and I imagine any one of us here could nail it on a $99 Behringer guitar into a $49 practice amp on the right day with the wind at our back.

My wife bought me a DVD of Hendrix on the Dick Cavett show and there was Jimi playing a Flying V straight into a B-15 Portaflex likely borrowed from one of the house band members, at levels acceptable to the production staff, and damn if it didn't sound EXACTLY like everything you typically associated with a white Strat through a Marshall stack and a Roger Mayer pedal of some kind. There were only two things in common between those two scenarios: the Flying V was also white, and Jimi's fingers. I strongly doubt the white paint was the determining factor.

If you go to the Sugarmegs site (http://tela.sugarmegs.org/_asxtela/_new_additions.html a vast repository of concerts people have surreptitiously recorded over the years), you'll find some Hendrix "concerts" that are not a whole lot more organized than a bunch of 19 year-olds having band practice in the basement. My sense, especially after viewing the Cavett appearances is that Jimi was a very shy guy and quick to apologize for any absence of professionalism or perfection. Maybe it WAS due to impossible sleeping schedules (as seems the case on cavett), but it translated into a lot of nervous hesitant introductions that evoke sentiments of "Just PLAY already!" from the listener.

One of the other things you'll find there (at Sugarmegs) is that the concert recordings depict the tone of our collective favourites in their naked form. Remember these are not commercial releases of concerts with post-production enhancements. These are folks holding a circa-1972 5" reel-to-reel and a single dynamic mic, and what you hear is what the player of your choice (and they are ALL there, folks, from Allman, Beck, Buchanan, and Clapton, through to Trower, Young and Zappa) sounded like to themselves when they played. It is the tone they got without studio trickery or overdubs.

If you want to just cream your jeans with guitar tone, check out this recording of Danny "The Humbler" Gatton: http://tela.sugarmegs.org/_asxtela/D...s_lonestar.asx Go to the 22-minute mark and listen to his tone on "Harlem Nocturne". It's enough to make the staunchest Wahabi-ist give pause for thought as to whether they've been praying to the right god all this time. Tone like that comes from beyond technology.

And Dave, I recently heard a live recording of Boz doing "Dime" with John Hetherington playing and it's pretty kickass too. He nails Duane's tone, and injects his own as well.

[JGundry]

I got some cast A5 magnets from a supplier. One magnet was cast but had all faces of the magnet ground smooth. The other had only the north and south pole edges ground smooth. The rest of the magnet was the dark, rough cast surface. The unground magnet did have more top end air to it. There are two factors I can think of that might explain the difference in tone. The act of grinding would likely knock down the magnetism of the ground magnet. Another possible factor would be that the rough cast, oxidized surfaces of the unground magnet are less conductive than the ground magnet. The cast surfaces are a resistive surface. I don't know if it would have the same effect as the DiMarzio Air PAF trick has? Where they place a non conductive shim between the slug and the magnet edge but it seems it might have an effect especially if the north and south edges of the magnet were not ground smooth. It certainly is making the magnet less conductive against the base plate.

[CL-10]

Rough Cast supplier

Hello--I'm Dave and I'm new to the forum. I was directed to the forum after Emailing Steven Kersting for some information. (THANKS Mr. Kersting!!). I have just started dabbling in winding. I saw that some here might be looking for Rough Cast Magnets. I recently bought a batch from "All Star" Magnets if anyone is interested. I bought both Alnico 2 and Alnico 4. The rep. Bob Paar stated that they also had Alnico 5 available. I have'nt got to play around with them much yet, but so far so good. The magnets are already charged. I put a set of Alnico 4's in some S.D. Antiquities I have, that had pretty weak magnets, and so far I like the tones. I also tried some Alnico 2's in some S.D. '59's which are in a fairly Bright guitar and am pleased with the results--so far. Hope this helps if your looking for Rough Cast Magnets

[Zhangliqun]

I talked to Fralin on the phone one day to get some A4's from him way back when. He told me he uses nothing but A4's on his humbuckers, but does keep some A5's on hand in case a customer complains that the pickup doesn't have enough output.

The Burstbucker mags are designed to look like old oxidized PAF mags. I'm guessing they cast them with a rough surface dye (or maybe even actual sand?) to give them that pitted look. They are also slightly shorter as some PAF mags were, 2.25" instead of 2.5".

As far as I know there are only two basic ways to make Alnico magnets, cast and sintered. Sintered Alnico is made by mixing the metals in powder that is then put under great pressure to form it into the shape. It's magnetically a bit weaker than cast Alnico but can be made into more intricate shapes.

The people I've talked to in the mag biz say that all Alnico bar and rod mags used for pickups are cast.