RoHS Compliance

[David Schwab]

david, where did you see the list that nickel silver fretwire was banned- a link if you can remeber please.
Navigating the immense amount of information is difficult.
I did see someone filed for an exception on musical instruments but havent found if it was passed, regected or waiting for consideration

Jason, I happened to see this because someone at the MIMF forum was asking about if anyone makes black fretwire. So David King mentioned that LMI makes gold fretwire, so I went to look, just expecting it to be a different alloy for what ever reason, just as they have stainless steel wire.

the link is: http://www.lmii.com/CartTwo/thirdpro...ader=+Fretwire

The blurb I posted was from that page. So the only info I have is from reading that... maybe nickel is not an issue, but they seem to think it is.

[jason lollar]

exceptions

http://www.newark.com/services/rohs/...ons_060629.pdf

However I talked to a big pickup manufacturer and they said there are no exceptions allowed, switch to leadless solder, the covers are fine because they are homogonous but check with all your wire suppliers. Tinned wire will not be acceptable.
The reason the solder used in a pickup is not allowed is because you could cut the pickup apart and seperate the components- its not homogonous.

[Just Bob]

Tinned wire will not be acceptable.

Note that wire tinned with pure tin or a non-hazardous tin alloy is acceptable. It's only the older stuff that's tinned with tin-lead alloy that is not allowed. Many wire suppliers still have both versions. I don't export anything yet and prefer to use the older stuff when I can get it.

Unfortunately the new stuff does not solder as well and is not as corrosion resistant or crack resistant. Same goes for PC boards. The old solder-plate boards could sit on the shelf for years and still be solderable. The new tin plated stuff tarnishes pretty quickly.

[ken]

I got an exemption for using nitro lacquer... could a pickup maker be exempted from all this because it could be argued that you aren't 'mass producing' pickups, it's more of an 'artisan' thing? For us small pickup makers, the actual impact on the environment would be negligible. After all, we aren't using wave solder fountains 24/7 or anything.

I have a female friend who is stressin' about this because she makes stained glass windows as a hobby, and her hobby would be almost impossible under this program.

Ken

[jason lollar]

this applies to the EU, Japan and China.
China- havent sold anything there anyway.

Ken what do you mean you got an exception for spraying nitro? does it have anything to do with RoHS?
Arguing that you are too small to make a difference- I dont think thats going to fly. Customs opens a box with 4 or 5 grand worth of pickups and they are going to hit you for the paperwork or compliance- maybe if you just ship one set of pickups at a time youll get away with it by not being noticed- I dont know-but alot of us sell in quantities to guitar factories, distributors or retailers. If you dont now you may in the future.
I wonder what the fine is if you get caught trying to sneak one set in?
Probably better to comply than it is to take a chance.

[Stan H]

Will they test the products or will you have to send proof of compliance with the shipment. Sorry to sound so lost...it's just that I am. I ship alot to UK and Singapore. Just ordered a couple of spools of silver solder. Now I'm broke!

-Stan

[soundmasterg]

I work at Rodgers Instruments LLC in Oregon, where we make church organs and theater organs and keyboards. We're part of the Roland group and make some of their products too. We've been fighting with ROHS issues for the better part of a year. The solder that you have to use with it basically sucks, and you need to have a soldering station that will go at higher temps, and even then it sucks compared to leaded solder. Since I'm not producing anything myself, it doesn't bother me at the moment, but I intend to produce things like pickups or amps or guitars in the future, and it would impact me then. This is a case of government getting in the way of the consumer and the producer in a big way with burdensome and not well-thought-out regulations in my opinion. If they would take care of things on a recycling and trash level instead of at the producer level then there wouldn't be a problem. As a species we could recycle a LOT more than we do now, but its too much bother for everyone.

[ken]

I live in an area where air quality is starting to be monitored, so I had to talk
to the local EPA about using nitrocellulose lacquer. I was told that I didn't use enough of the stuff at once to be considered a pollution source, so I wasn't really to be worried about. I was just using the nitro as a example, anyway.
Do you have 'air quality cops' where you live?

Maybe it is better to ship one box at a time, I did some research and compliance will be murder. It sounds to me like another case of 'trying to kill a mosquito with a machine gun'.

Frankly, I can't see anyone testing just one box of pickups, the manhours wasted would be enormous. Maybe there will be exemptions for items with long expected lifespans, like in a prior post. I spent years wave soldering and working with SMT parts in an OEM plant, and I was also a copper/gold/nickel/tin-lead plater in another board shop. I'm waiting to be found that my whole body isn't compliant.

I admit I don't produce as much as you guys do, but I'm working on it.
I am wondering what will be next to be regulated...

If people spent as much time and effort recycling used products as they did chasing the 'new improved', we probably wouldn't be in this mess.

Ken

[JGundry]

http://www.newark.com/services/rohs/...ons_060629.pdf

However I talked to a big pickup manufacturer and they said there are no exceptions allowed, switch to leadless solder, the covers are fine because they are homogonous but check with all your wire suppliers. Tinned wire will not be acceptable.
The reason the solder used in a pickup is not allowed is because you could cut the pickup apart and seperate the components- its not homogonous.

Did this big manufacturer suggest a low melting point lead free solder?

[WolfeMacleod]

http://www.newark.com/services/rohs/...ons_060629.pdf

However I talked to a big pickup manufacturer and they said there are no exceptions allowed, switch to leadless solder, the covers are fine because they are homogonous but check with all your wire suppliers. Tinned wire will not be acceptable.
The reason the solder used in a pickup is not allowed is because you could cut the pickup apart and seperate the components- its not homogonous.

5th Batch Exemption proposals:

#3Use of lead in Solder applications for electronic components of musical intruments having an average lifespan in excess of ten years.

#8 ...professional audio equiment...

So..let's hope they pass...


Looking back on #3, it could easily be argued that the average lifespan of a [well constructed] pickup is easily more than 20 or 30 years.

To who asked me the question - the solder joints are failing. I think the high heat is partially vaporizing the copper.

[Just Bob]

I saw that a requested exemption to use lead solder for making speakers was withdrawn or denied. I expect that they will not be too free with the exemptions since everybody wants them and the performance of the lead-free stuff is poor.

Re: solder joint failures - Can't be that the copper is vaporizing. Not hot enough. But, it could be that the copper is forming a eutectic with the tin. Essentially dissolved by the tin. Could also be a flux corrosion problem. There are solder alloys that include a percentage of copper to stop the eutectic problem. I'd take a picture of a failed joint under a microscope and send it to Kester and Alpha. They can tell you what will fix it. I have switched to a solder paste and hot-air soldering, although it will work with a regular iron. Sn96.5/Ag3.0/Cu.5. Seems to work better because the flux is mixed in with the solder. Not cheap, but not bad. About $25 for a syringe or $50 for a half pound. I get it from http://www.stencilsunlimited.com/solder_products.php Way cheaper than Kester. Needs to be kept refrigerated, which is a bit of a pain. They ship it in ice packs unless you order in the winter.

[David Schwab]

this applies to the EU, Japan and China.
China- havent sold anything there anyway.

I just sent a pickup to New Zealand... I guess they aren't included in this. Didn't have any issues with customs. <whew!>

Has anyone tried silver solder? I've never used it in electronic situations, but it was easy to work with.

I wonder if encapsulated pickups (such as EMG, Bartolini, and Armstrong) are affected by the lead solder ban, since they are sealed units?

I have to agree this really needs to be dealt with at the recycling end of things. (how often are pickups thrown in the trash?) I wonder what the big pickup makers are going to do?

[Alex/Tubewonder]

It is dealt with at the recycling end of things too. WEEE directive
ROHS directive deals with manufacturing end, WEEE steps in at products end of life.
As manufacturer, distributor or retailer you/we are responsible for proper disposal/recycling. The crossed out waste bin symbol on a product means not only that it must not be thrown away but has to be returned to whoever put it on the market for proper disposal.

[jason lollar]

they dont even monitor car emmisions where I live.

Kester #275 is what they told me.
The bigger guys are all complying- thats whats happenin

[JGundry]

they dont even monitor car emmisions where I live.

Kester #275 is what they told me.
The bigger guys are all complying- thats whats happenin

Bummer #275 is what I use for effects and it is very blobby and hard to work with especially on finer things like transistor leads. The higher temperatures toast the flux on the solder tip very quickly and that makes the blobbing worse. I have not tried it with magnet wire yet but my guess that you will have to flux the pigtail leads before hand if you want to get a blob free joint for humbuckers.