Wire: SP vs. SPN

[kayakerca]

What is the difference (other than nylon/no nylon coating) between

Solderable Polyurethane (SP)

and

Solderable Polyurethane Nylon (SPN)

I am looking to order some more 42AWG. My first 10 lb. spool was 42 AWG SPN155 through BAE (Electrosol label). Remington pricing is better, but SP insulation vs. SPN.

Any experience with these different insulations and how they affect aspects of pickups/winding?

Thanks in advance.

[big_teee]

Hi Jim:
I don't know either, but I have both.
Can't tell any noticeable difference with either one.
If your talking nearly the same price, you may want to stick with BAE.
Remington had all the Bad SP, that wrapped under the coils that broke.
Didn't hear about any of that with anyone but Remington.
See if TeenaR@baewire.com won't deal a better price.
Also before I buy any more wire, they are going to have to guarantee the size.
No more of the too small minimum .0025" wire.
I had rather it be in th .00265 range.
Good Luck,
T
**Edit
On the .0025 size, what Elektrisola says it is on the spool is no where close to what it Mic's.

[kayakerca]

Hi Jim:
I don't know either, but I have both.
Can't tell any noticeable difference with either one.
If your talking nearly the same price, you may want to stick with BAE.
Remington had all the Bad SP, that wrapped under the coils that broke.
Didn't hear about any of that with anyone but Remington.
See if TeenaR@baewire.com won't deal a better price.
Also before I buy any more wire, they are going to have to guarantee the size.
No more of the too small minimum .0025" wire.
I had rather it be in th .00265 range.
Good Luck,
T
**Edit
On the .0025 size, what Elektrisola says it is on the spool is no where close to what it Mic's.

Remington is just under $14/lb., which is a fair bit less than BAE pricing. I sent Teena a note to see if there is any room for movement on price. I have been happy with what I have bought from BAE todate. I also like the 6" spools and BAE only carries the small ones on the 42 SPN.

[big_teee]

I love a bargain!
With that said I will not buy anymore wire without assurance of size.
IMO You can't make great Pickups, without great wire.
And, that little bitty Minimum wire, IMO is not Great wire.

[kayakerca]

I love a bargain!
With that said I will not buy anymore wire without assurance of size.
IMO You can't make great Pickups, without great wire.
And, that little bitty Minimum wire, IMO is not Great wire.

I like this place, I learn something everyday. Here is the spec chart from Elektrisola (specifically 42 wire).



The min/norm/max helps explain why the DCR could vary for similar turn winds. Are other wire manufacturer's wire similar in spec to the Elektrisola specs?

Still wondering about SP vs. SPN thing. Remington (who sells SP not SPN) says Elektrosola tells them the SP is better and SPN is more designed for ~ 32 AWG and up. Everything is just so interesting.

[big_teee]

I like this place, I learn something everyday. Here is the spec chart from Elektrisola (specifically 42 wire).

[ATTACH=CONFIG]22716[/ATTACH]

The min/norm/max helps explain why the DCR could vary for similar turn winds. Are other wire manufacturer's wire similar in spec to the Elektrisola specs?

Still wondering about SP vs. SPN thing. Remington (who sells SP not SPN) says Elektrosola tells them the SP is better and SPN is more designed for ~ 32 AWG and up. Everything is just so interesting.

It's too bad they don't follow their own chart!
They are selling lots of wire below min levels.
Once Shame on them.
If it happens twice, Shame on me!
T

[kayakerca]

It's too bad they don't follow their own chart!
They are selling lots of wire below min levels.
Once Shame on them.
If it happens twice, Shame on me!
T

Whose wire are you using Terry? I have 4 types if wire from BAE and it is all Elektrisola.

[big_teee]

Whose wire are you using Terry? I have 4 types if wire from BAE and it is all Elektrisola.

Last wire I bought was last summer.
I wanted some red SPN.
Remington didn't have it yet, but was getting some soon.
I couldn't wait so I bought a 7-1/2 lb roll of the Natural Elektrisola.
The wire is great a little over .0026, and makes good pickups, but it breaks on the end of the tapered roll on a regular basis.
So as soon as the red came in I bought a 6-1/2 lb roll of the red elektrisola, and it spools off great.
It is the tiny, barely .0025" wire.(Insulation and all)
You can tell it when you use it.
It is 42awg, I measured it per foot, and mic'd it many many times.
It says it is larger on the spool.
They won't screw me like that again.
So I use that spool for kind of special apps.
When 42 won't fit, but 43 is too small.
I still would like to have a good roll of .00265-.0027" SPN, regardless of the color.
Anyway enough of that, just want everyone to know what is going on out there, in the cold cruel world!
So IMHO what is going on now is the WalMart Syndrome!
After they put the other wire companies out of business, they will sell us what they want us to have.
Not what We want!
I still contend you can't make big sounding dynamic pickups with little scrawny wire!
End of Rant!
T

[kayakerca]

Last wire I bought was last summer.
I wanted some red SPN.
Remington didn't have it yet, but was getting some soon.
I couldn't wait so I bought a 7-1/2 lb roll of the Natural Elektrisola.
The wire is great a little over .0026, and makes good pickups, but it breaks on the end of the tapered roll on a regular basis.
So as soon as the red came in I bought a 6-1/2 lb roll of the red elektrisola, and it spools off great.
It is the tiny, barely .0025" wire.(Insulation and all)
You can tell it when you use it.
It is 42awg, I measured it per foot, and mic'd it many many times.
It says it is larger on the spool.
They won't screw me like that again.
So I use that spool for kind of special apps.
When 42 won't fit, but 43 is too small.
I still would like to have a good roll of .00265-.0027" SPN, regardless of the color.
Anyway enough of that, just want everyone to know what is going on out there, in the cold cruel world!
So IMHO what is going on now is the WalMart Syndrome!
After they put the other wire companies out of business, they will sell us what they want us to have.
Not what We want!
I still contend you can't make big sounding dynamic pickups with little scrawny wire!
End of Rant!
T

It hardly counts as a rant if you are imparting information AND NOT SHOUTING! ! !

Still curious as to why (or why not) SPN over SP though. . . You think the nylon top coats might be strictly a durability benefit?

[Stratz]

Still curious as to why (or why not) SPN over SP though. . . You think the nylon top coats might be strictly a durability benefit?

I dont use much poly but what I think Terry is saying is that the OD of SP compared to SPN is at the very low end of the minimum advertised size. The nylon must add a little more to the overall diameter which makes it closer to .0027-28" than 0026" or even smaller.

[Tom Foy]

I've seen it mentioned on some manufacturers' sites that the nylon overcoat is hygroscopic. I understand that to mean that the relative permittivity of the insulation will increase as it absorbs water, causing more capacitance in the coil, and therefore reduced high frequency output.
Litz Wire - Litz Film Insulations

[Joe Gwinn]

I've seen it mentioned on some manufacturers' sites that the nylon overcoat is hygroscopic. I understand that to mean that the relative permittivity of the insulation will increase as it absorbs water, causing more capacitance in the coil, and therefore reduced high frequency output.
Litz Wire - Litz Film Insulations

That is exactly what the manufacturer is trying to say. The question is the size of the effect. I would ask the manufacturer.