Bad humbucker question.

[Justwannano]

I wound two HB's- both Aln2 one 7.2 (wonderful neck pup) and one 7.8 but it wasn't right. (bridge pup)

It is very bright, very weak compared to the other and the G/D or 3rd and 4th poles are so weak it's nuts.

Both were potted.
Both were kits from Mojo and both 42AWG.

What are the possible issues to get those bad results?
I don't have a clue how two poles could be so bad using a bar magnet.
And thanks for any thoughts about this.

Mike

[big_teee]

Hi Mike:
On the weak G&D, the only thing I can think of is magnet gauss.
If you don't have a gauss meter, take a unmagnetized piece of steel, and stick it to each pole screw, and slug.
If the G, & D poles don't have as much magnetic pull then, you are talking about a magnet not being fully charged.
If that is the case, slide the magnet out and recharge it.
On the Bridge being bright, 7.8 is a little underwound, for a bridge position pickup.
That would cause it to be pretty bright.
T

[Justwannano]

Hi Terry,
Thank you.

I do have a meter. It's something like a dial indicator that goes 50-0-50.
I didn't check the magnets either. Probably not smart of me.

I may also have mismatched the coils in that I wound one 4500 and the other 5250.
If you would make a recommendation I would appreciate it very much.

I'm going to wind up another to replace the bad one- I'm doing this for a picker friend
so I'll just keep the bad one and try to see what went south with it....or me.

So...just a couple of the screw poles being weak is a strange deal?

Mike

[big_teee]

Look at the estimator and see if you can get what you want.
Coil Estimator
Start with the slug bobbin and wind it medium full.
Then wind the screw bobbin a hundred or so less turns.
So if You can easily get 5600 on the slug coil, wind 5500 on the screw bobbin for a bridge P/U.
That should make for a bridge with over 8k or so.
I would kept the offset low, or none.
I usually just do a little on the bridge and none on the neck.
If you want the pickup hotter, and you have room on the bobbin, then wind more.
The amount of turns you can get on a bobbin will depend on the bobbin, and the size of the wire.
They both vary quite a bit!
Be sure and check your magnets before you install them.
I hook the output to the slug coil, and put north of the magnet to the slug side.
Just like the Stewmac instructions.
STEWMAC.COM : Instructions for Humbucker Kit
Good Luck,
T
Others please jump in if you can help!

[Justwannano]

It'll be awhile before the kits arrive but I'll let you know
how it turns out.
I sure appreciate your help Terry.

Mike

[jason lollar]

resolder all your joints including the pigtails- sounds like you have a bad solder joint if the pickup is weak overall and bright sounding. You can have a pickup that reads the expected resistance but it can still be bad- if you dont check every pickup with an inductance meter and keep track of what the inductance should be depending on magnet type, strength and coil youll never know if you are sending out bunk if you only track resistance ot only do one offs you dont have past data on.

[big_teee]

I agree a Inductance meter would be great to have.
However it is not required to make a good usuable pickup.
Most winders that post here in the hobby section, including myself are mainly making one offs, and a few for friends.
I wish I had a inductance meter, but don't make enough pickups to justify one.
Same with Other test sets, they are nice if you have them.
Use what you have, and do the best you can with what you have!
T

[Jim Darr]

Mike,

My money is on a wiring sequence or hookup error.

If you are using vintage style push back hookup wire, make sure you have both "coil finishes" wired together and then the "starts" wired correctly to the pushback wire (traditionally the slug coil" start" is hot and the screw coil "start" is ground). If you are using 4 conductor hookup wire, check the wiring to each bobbin (coil start & finish) to make sure it is correct and proper according to the color coding of your hookup wire. I had a similar problem early on, with almost the same results as you’ve described, when I accidently wired the start of one coil to the finish of the other coil. DC resistance was fine, but it sounded weak and trebly.

If the wiring checks out okay, you might have wound one coil of the pickup in question “upside down”. In other words, make sure the tops and bottoms of each bobbin are mounted the same way (directionally) on your winder. I strongly believe this is why Gibson went from the PAF bobbin style to the T-TOP. The “T” indicated the top of coil so errors just like this wouldn’t happen as much. If this is the case DC resistance would show as fine.

The offset you described shouldn’t be a contributing factor to your problem.

Also, as stated earlier by Terry, make sure the gauss levels are correct for the magnet (pickup) in question - do this first. Hope this helps. Let us know what the problem actually was.

Jim

[Justwannano]

Jason I learned of your book not long ago and bought it. You're the reason I built my winder
and have had a fantastic time seeing how far I can take this.
No doubt I need to invest more to continue the learning but still on the basics and going slow. Thank you very much
for chiming in, I appreciate that.

Jim I'm sure thinking you're on track. Wiring it wrong sure does sound like
a goof I'd make and possibly as Jason mentioned, bad soldering.
I did use the braided wire that came with the kit and I thought I followed Seymour Duncans wiring guide.
I wound both CW and until I double check how I connected the S/F I can't say yet....other than I thought
I was doing both pups the same.

I will get to find out where I blew it this weekend and will post whatever I find. Sounds like it may be an embarrassing list.

Appreciate the help guys.
Mike

[jason lollar]

oh yes hooking up the coils so they are out of phase with each other would do that too.
T is right you dont need an inductance meter- you only need it if you want to make sure every pickup you make is good without having to listen to them all and it is also really helpful for maintaining consistancy- you can tell if you have the wrong magnet - you can tell alot of things. I got by without one for a long time but eventually I realized what it meant for consistancy and trouble free product.

[Justwannano]

Jason your advise is understood and appreciated.

Consistency is everything IMO.

I can easily understand the value of being able to determine the value/characteristics of the pickup without it being installed.

The venture has been to learn, not for monetary returns so if it's no more than a trade of money for knowledge/performance I'm good with that.
I'll inquire about recommended inductance meter when I'm prepared to purchase. I'm sure it's been mentioned somewhere here in the forums.
Well I know where my change jar coins will be going.

I did receive the guitar yesterday and now that the little monsters have been fed I'll pull it out when I get the cobwebs out of me head.

Thank you Jason.
Mike

[big_teee]

Jason your advise is understood and appreciated.

Consistency is everything IMO.

I can easily understand the value of being able to determine the value/characteristics of the pickup without it being installed.

The venture has been to learn, not for monetary returns so if it's no more than a trade of money for knowledge/performance I'm good with that.
I'll inquire about recommended inductance meter when I'm prepared to purchase. I'm sure it's been mentioned somewhere here in the forums.
Well I know where my change jar coins will be going.

I did receive the guitar yesterday and now that the little monsters have been fed I'll pull it out when I get the cobwebs out of me head.

Thank you Jason.
Mike

Curious if you found your problem?
T

[Justwannano]

I'll try this again...not sure where that first try went.

I didn't get a chance today but I did receive the kits from Mojo so
I hope to get to check it out tomorrow and windup a new one.

[big_teee]

I'll try this again...not sure where that first try went.

I didn't get a chance today but I did receive the kits from Mojo so
I hope to get to check it out tomorrow and windup a new one.

Don't know what color 28 ga wire you have for start and finish leads.
I like to use black for starts and white for finish.
Tie the the two white finish leads together.
That only leaves the two black leads to connect if your using the braided push back wire.
T

[mcgruff]

My money is on a wiring sequence or hookup error.

Yeah sounds a bit like they're out of phase.