Coil Geometry and Tone?

[ToneNerd]

Sorry if I couldn't find what i was looking for with the search function.

Generally speaking, it there a consensus the differences in tone based on the coil geometry such as:

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?

Thanks!

[copperheadroads]

Sounds like you got some experimenting to do ...

[ToneNerd]

I guess Ill start answering my own questions My assumption are that a fat coil with winds built up closer to the center of the bobbin yield a mid focused tone. This assumption is based on the product description of a well know winder. I have some more parts coming next week, I am going to do more R&D

These center focused coils create a fuller bobbin for the same number of turns than coils wound on the other known PAF winders, the Leesona 102, Slug 101 and ME-301. The result is a PAF pickup reproduction with added scatter for a woolly low end and crispy/crunchy mids.

[big_teee]

No ads in tech area, please.

[ToneNerd]

No ads please.

My apologies, I edited it out of respect, but I am a bit confused since my link was strictly from a technical discussion standpoint with no personal benefit. In a few other threads on the first page, I see links to vendors as well as people having there personal business links in their signature.

[mozz]

Don't fall for the scatter wound description when i comes to PAF style pickups. They were never hand wound and the only scatter would be from a non perfectly balanced or setup machine or parts used to make them. I'm not one to use double sided tape as i think you can not get it perfectly centered by eye. Almost everything i wind you can see it vibrating somewhat. As to the other side of the coin, if you wind it perfect, such as the generic factory crap sold today, it will be lifeless and dull. If you are making inductors, yes, wind them perfect.

EDIT: for strat coils, think of how Leo would have taught his employees. He most likely showed them how to go back and forth, nice and evenly fill the bobbin. As soon as he walked away they most likely either did it real fast, or left it unattended and filled in the low spots before it ended. You have to experiment as was said.

[Antigua]

Maybe move this to the "pickup theory" section?

Technical discussions about the significance of coil geometry in general says it shouldn't make much of a difference. Each turn of wire generates a voltage, all connected in series for a sum voltage that is "usable". So if you have a lot of turns near the guitars strings, where the magnetic fluctuation is stronger, you get more sum voltage than if you have more turns further away from the strings. The permeability of the pole pieces determine how much magnetic fluctuation reaches the core, and lower portions of the coil, so if the pole pieces are steel, the shape of the coils theoretically matters much less than if you have AlNiCo or ceramic pole pieces.

I think what probably changes more with coil shape is the overall inductance value of the coil, and the effect that has on the resonant peak. I think that no matter the shape of the coil, the bobbin shape and thickness of the coil is mostly what determines the inductance for a given amount of turns, but the outer shape must have some impact on the inductive coupling of all the turns and would have a small affect on the inductance. The neatness of the layers also factors in, neatly layered wire will have a better coupling and a higher inductance, and the inherent sloppiness of winding such fine wire is why inductance always differs slightly from one coil to the next, but I have noticed that machine wound import pickups tend to have a more consistent inductance than hand guided pickups.

[mozz]

Since i got the CNC winder i have done a few experiments. Poly 42awg. It was strat single coils, 8000 turns. First was 2000 turns tight tension and the remaining 6000 turns somewhat looser(but nothing too loose). I have a external adjustable tensioner. Wound a set of 3. Next i did the same but went 4000 turns tight 4000 looser. I have not installled these on loaded pickguards yet as that was my goal to swap them out. I did measure the inductance and it was almost exact between the sets. I didn't calculate capacitance but will see if that has much difference. I will also try 50% less tpl to see what that produces.