Need a new coil winder

[DialtonePickups]

Hi guys! It's been awhile - I hope everyone is doing well.

We've been using the CNC mini winder, but we've just had problem after problem with it, so I'm throwing in the towel on the winder. (Problems have been anything from receiving the winder with bad components and having to replace them to intermittent communication issues between the winder and computer to traverse working inconsistently. That said, when it works as expected, it's great.)

I've looked at all of the threads I can find on winders and have some ideas, but I wanted to ask if anyone had any recommendations.

We're looking to spend $600-$700 max, and would prefer one with auto-traverse.

If I can't find one that's better, we'll probably go withe Mojotone's - Mojotone Pickup Winding Machine.

Thanks!
Tory

[Jim Darr]

Tory,

There is a HUGE difference in tone consistency in a "Hand Guided" winder and one that controls TPL. Auto traverse machines really come in two varieties: 1) Mechanical (usually old school vintage winders with a CAM Driven Traverse) where you essentially have the same TPL pattern throughout the coil and; 2) CNC Traverse controlled machines where TPL can be varied 'layer-to-layer" if so desired.

Hand guided machines are great for many applications for both Single and Double Coil. Controlled Auto Traverse machines get consistency pickup-to-pickup once an acceptable "formula or recipe" is developed. My issue with hand guided pickups is mostly consistency as can be seen in most of the single coils of the 50s and 60s...you find great sounding ones, and you find lemons. For the record I started with hand-guiding and still have both hand guided machines and mechanical auto traverse machines. An additional point to consider in hand guided winding is that it is hard to scale your business should demand increase dramatically and making each pickup is generally very labor intensive.

I would suggest, if this is more than a hobby for you, to find a good CNC winder (both new or used) and adjust your purchase price point. If you are just starting out, or order volumes are low, go with the hand guided winder (the one you mentioned has had some good reviews here on this Forum and seems well made with good features). Is there any way to fortify or fix your existing CNC machine?

Good luck and keep us posted on your decision.

Jim

[big_teee]

I have the mojo hand winder.
I had trouble with the first one, but #2 is a great machine.
I had mojo spend a day winding on it, before they sent it out.
What is great about it is the countdown feature.
You program how many turns and it kicks off when you reach that amount of turns.
It remembers the last turns setting and is repeatable.
I wound 4- 12,000 turn round bobbins last night in under an hour.
That time included soldering the 28 awg tails and taping.
It will turn 1200 rpm, and I run it on high most of the time.
They are supposed to have a 2.0 issue that goes faster.
If this one goes out, I will buy another one, unless something better comes along.
If you buy one, make sure you get them to test it out first!
And, don't forget the gauss feature, I dig that too.
You don't have to drag out another test device.
As far as consistency, I've never had any problems.
I bet you would do fine with it!
T

[kayakerca]

Hi guys! It's been awhile - I hope everyone is doing well.

We've been using the CNC mini winder, but we've just had problem after problem with it, so I'm throwing in the towel on the winder. (Problems have been anything from receiving the winder with bad components and having to replace them to intermittent communication issues between the winder and computer to traverse working inconsistently. That said, when it works as expected, it's great.)

I've looked at all of the threads I can find on winders and have some ideas, but I wanted to ask if anyone had any recommendations.

We're looking to spend $600-$700 max, and would prefer one with auto-traverse.

If I can't find one that's better, we'll probably go withe Mojotone's - Mojotone Pickup Winding Machine.

Thanks!
Tory

I hear you on the "intermittent communication" thing. I went a year and a half with my (home brew) CNC winder "going off the rails" every 4th or 5th pickup. Drove me nuts! Finally after a ton of "ah ha" moments that come to you at 4:00 in the morning, I figured out the problem, fixed the code and now it runs just beautifully! I couldn't be happier. I really like the CNC thing that you can start running then just step away and do something else. I usually only wind a couple thousand turns at a time as I like to check to see that the wire is laying down like I want it to.

Here's my baby!



Were you using the CNCDuDez CNC Mini Winder? That looks like one beautiful little unit. Love the mounting plate. If your CNC Mini Winder runs with 1.8° bipolar stepper motors and you were feeling like digging in and getting your hands dirty a bit, you could invest a little less than $200 Cdn. and pickup up a pair of Phidgets bipolar steppers controllers and try my software with your hardware. The only thing I think that would be needed to be figured out would be the resolution (distance the traverse travels for each step of the motor) of the traverser stepper motor on the traverse pulley as it would be different that my overly expensive traverser motor. But that math should be pretty once you know the diameter of the pulley that drives the belt. My software isn't fancy, but all the parameters are there and extremely easy to use. Just a thought. . .

I love my little home brew CNC winder.

[David King]

I really think Elepro's all in one controller has a lot of potential and no PC required. I haven't had any time to play with mine yet but i know at least a few other folks here have them and might report back.

You should also consider the new Gecko driver device that can hold many lines of G-code for stand-alone operation. http://www.geckodrive.com/gm215-step...ontroller.html
That would be a totally bulletproof solution with world class support.

This one on Ebay looks killer for the price Serbig Armature Coil Winder | eBay probably cost $20k new but it's tanked so you'd need to invest in a new set of controllers or god know what. Figure another $400 for shipping.

Keep an eye out for an Adams Maxwell 1200 or a Tanac AX3 on a bargain bin sale.

[DialtonePickups]

Tory,

There is a HUGE difference in tone consistency in a "Hand Guided" winder and one that controls TPL. Auto traverse machines really come in two varieties: 1) Mechanical (usually old school vintage winders with a CAM Driven Traverse) where you essentially have the same TPL pattern throughout the coil and; 2) CNC Traverse controlled machines where TPL can be varied 'layer-to-layer" if so desired.

Hand guided machines are great for many applications for both Single and Double Coil. Controlled Auto Traverse machines get consistency pickup-to-pickup once an acceptable "formula or recipe" is developed. My issue with hand guided pickups is mostly consistency as can be seen in most of the single coils of the 50s and 60s...you find great sounding ones, and you find lemons. For the record I started with hand-guiding and still have both hand guided machines and mechanical auto traverse machines. An additional point to consider in hand guided winding is that it is hard to scale your business should demand increase dramatically and making each pickup is generally very labor intensive.

I would suggest, if this is more than a hobby for you, to find a good CNC winder (both new or used) and adjust your purchase price point. If you are just starting out, or order volumes are low, go with the hand guided winder (the one you mentioned has had some good reviews here on this Forum and seems well made with good features). Is there any way to fortify or fix your existing CNC machine?

Good luck and keep us posted on your decision.

Jim

Our pickups are active, so scattered for us don't change tone enough to notice. That said - we've been hand-guiding for the most part because the traverse functional most never works.

Thanks for the other winding/winder tips. We have fixed our machine so many times, and it's caused me so much trouble that I'm ready to throw it out the window! I can't tell you how many times I've gotten 500-1000 turns away from being done and suddenly the traverse decides to go in the opposite direction, or the winder decides to stop early for no good reason but I might not notice the count is off until after I've pulled the coil off.

[DialtonePickups]

I have the mojo hand winder.
I had trouble with the first one, but #2 is a great machine.
I had mojo spend a day winding on it, before they sent it out.
What is great about it is the countdown feature.
You program how many turns and it kicks off when you reach that amount of turns.
It remembers the last turns setting and is repeatable.
I wound 4- 12,000 turn round bobbins last night in under an hour.
That time included soldering the 28 awg tails and taping.
It will turn 1200 rpm, and I run it on high most of the time.
They are supposed to have a 2.0 issue that goes faster.
If this one goes out, I will buy another one, unless something better comes along.
If you buy one, make sure you get them to test it out first!
And, don't forget the gauss feature, I dig that too.
You don't have to drag out another test device.
As far as consistency, I've never had any problems.
I bet you would do fine with it!
T

Thanks Big_Teee! I'd seen that you liked the Mojotone winder in a different post. I figured if it's good enough for you, it should be more than enough for us.

Was Mojotone really willing to test it beforehand for you? That's great - I'll give it a shot if we go with it. I'm most excited about not having to plug in a computer. That has surprisingly been a big pain in the neck - booting it up, getting the software running correctly, accidentally knocking the USB plug out, etc.

[DialtonePickups]

I hear you on the "intermittent communication" thing. I went a year and a half with my (home brew) CNC winder "going off the rails" every 4th or 5th pickup. Drove me nuts! Finally after a ton of "ah ha" moments that come to you at 4:00 in the morning, I figured out the problem, fixed the code and now it runs just beautifully! I couldn't be happier. I really like the CNC thing that you can start running then just step away and do something else. I usually only wind a couple thousand turns at a time as I like to check to see that the wire is laying down like I want it to.

Here's my baby!

[ATTACH=CONFIG]33602[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]33601[/ATTACH]

Were you using the CNCDuDez CNC Mini Winder? That looks like one beautiful little unit. Love the mounting plate. If your CNC Mini Winder runs with 1.8° bipolar stepper motors and you were feeling like digging in and getting your hands dirty a bit, you could invest a little less than $200 Cdn. and pickup up a pair of Phidgets bipolar steppers controllers and try my software with your hardware. The only thing I think that would be needed to be figured out would be the resolution (distance the traverse travels for each step of the motor) of the traverser stepper motor on the traverse pulley as it would be different that my overly expensive traverser motor. But that math should be pretty once you know the diameter of the pulley that drives the belt. My software isn't fancy, but all the parameters are there and extremely easy to use. Just a thought. . .

I love my little home brew CNC winder.

It's a CNC Mini Winder. I love to dig in and get my hands dirty, but not with electronics! I prefer for them to just work. Your winder seems really nice -- I agree, stepping away and doing something out is great. I'm definitely going to miss it if we go with one without a traverse, although I also like having an excuse to sit there and watch TV.

[kayakerca]

It's a CNC Mini Winder. I love to dig in and get my hands dirty, but not with electronics! I prefer for them to just work. Your winder seems really nice -- I agree, stepping away and doing something out is great. I'm definitely going to miss it if we go with one without a traverse, although I also like having an excuse to sit there and watch TV.

If you are going to toss it to the trash, let me know what you'd let it go for (just the hardware). Be fun to hook it up to my app just for something else to keep me out of trouble.

[the great waldo]

It's a CNC Mini Winder. I love to dig in and get my hands dirty, but not with electronics! I prefer for them to just work. Your winder seems really nice -- I agree, stepping away and doing something out is great. I'm definitely going to miss it if we go with one without a traverse, although I also like having an excuse to sit there and watch TV.

Which CNC winder is it ? Can you be a bit more specific as to the manufacturer ?

Cheers

Andrew

[DialtonePickups]

Which CNC winder is it ? Can you be a bit more specific as to the manufacturer ?

Cheers

Andrew

Oh! Sorry, I thought Mini CNC was the name of the machine. It's this one: http://www.ukcnc.info/forums/Mini_Coil_Winder.php

[DialtonePickups]

If you are going to toss it to the trash, let me know what you'd let it go for (just the hardware). Be fun to hook it up to my app just for something else to keep me out of trouble.

We won't toss it. My husband, John, is usually pretty comfortable with gadgets and I'm sure will fix it again, but I know I can't count on it to work when I need to. John works in DC so it's really hard to put everything on hold for a couple of weeks while I wait for him to get back to work on it. I think we'll get a secondary machine to use, and we'll probably end up going between both.

[the great waldo]

Get in touch with Sean at cncdudez he should be able to walk you through any problems. He's always been very forgiving with some of the totally daft questions I have put to him.

Cheers

Andrew

We won't toss it. My husband, John, is usually pretty comfortable with gadgets and I'm sure will fix it again, but I know I can't count on it to work when I need to. John works in DC so it's really hard to put everything on hold for a couple of weeks while I wait for him to get back to work on it. I think we'll get a secondary machine to use, and we'll probably end up going between both.

[Joe Gwinn]

Our pickups are active, so scattered for us don't change tone enough to notice. That said - we've been hand-guiding for the most part because the traverse functional most never works.

It sounds like you might be happy with a good mechanical winder.

[David King]

I'd ask CNC dudez if they can't just port their software into the Gecko GM 215 so you can skip the PC and external linkages. Gecko makes world class drivers that run hundreds of thousands of commercial CNC machines all over the world.
You might contact Elepro to see if he has any PCBs and eproms for his winder left. It's a quick build and would be really easy to integrate with what you have now. I'm think that their problems may stem from the drivers and steppers being too small and skipping steps.