seeking opinions on cheap mixers

[popoahi]

I'd like some input from users of the inexpensive mixers on the market like behringer, mackie, etc..

I need a 16 or more channel mixer.. I currently use 15" non-powered yamaha spkrs...no sub.

I'd like input on ease of useage, what features or lack of certain features,, how good or bad the reverb is which of course is essential, and other features the board might have like flanger, vibrato, chorus, etc...

I was planning to fix my 16 chnl yamaha, well nothings really wrong except a couple of broken tops of the sliders.

but decided against it because the thing is just to heavy to lug around!!! guessing it must weigh at least 150lbs. (feels like 200lbs). not to mention the size of the board is huge...

just to old to carry that weight and some of the numbers and stuff are gone from age and corrosion... I can remember what they are but it would be nice to see them..

mainly some of the prices are so good these days I'd like to get a 20, 24 chnl mixer,,, the drums use 5 chnls right from the start...I want to use my non-powered spkrs to keep expenses down. do any of the new mixers allow me to just switch to powered spkrs later???

so want to hear from guys who have used these new cheaper mixers???

aloha, popoahi

[Enzo]

You have asked several things.

Mixers may or may not have built in power amps. Ones with amps are called powered mixers. Any powered mixer also has line out jacks that would feed powered speakers. SO you could use either type of speaker. On the other hand, the more channels you get, the fewer ones are powered.


Sit down and plan out a typical stage setup you would like. Don;'t add 20 extra mics just because it seems cool to put a pile of them on something, be reasonable. Is five drum mics cool? Or would you really like 6? Don't cheat yourself, but don;t go nuts either. Are there instruments you'd like to run through the PA, but are not? Maybe allowing for that expansion is a good idea. Having four channels too many is a lot better than four channels too few.

There are relatively inexpensive mixers, I think all mixers sound pretty good these days. The Behringer mixers work well enough in my view. Maybe some others are more robust, but really, get a road case and take care of it, and any mixer will last. To me, service is a larger matter. Any brand you consider, look into having it repaired. Where can it be fixed?


Powered mixers are OK for smaller systems, I tend to think of them for acts that mix from the stage. But the other side of that convenience is that the mixer is your whole system. If the power amp blows in your powered mixer, your mixer goes down with it.

[Mick Bailey]

I see a lot of low-cost powered mixers for repair and very often it's the power amp or PSU that fails, sometimes making the cost of repair uneconomical. That power amp is also cooking the rest of the electronics while the equipment is in use. My preference is for an unpowered mixer and separate power amp.

One of the problems with low-cost electronics can be the very short production life and subsequent spares availability. I recently enquired about a replacement transformer for a powered mixer for a working band and the lead time was over 6 months and more than 50% of the replacement cost of the entire desk.

Behringer won't supply spares or schematics (in the UK, at least) to non-authorised repair shops. Think about if you have to pack and ship it to get it repaired - even if it's under warranty.

[soundguruman]

I'd like some input from users of the inexpensive mixers on the market like behringer, mackie, etc..

I need a 16 or more channel mixer.. I currently use 15" non-powered yamaha spkrs...no sub.

I'd like input on ease of useage, what features or lack of certain features,, how good or bad the reverb is which of course is essential, and other features the board might have like flanger, vibrato, chorus, etc...

I was planning to fix my 16 chnl yamaha, well nothings really wrong except a couple of broken tops of the sliders.

but decided against it because the thing is just to heavy to lug around!!! guessing it must weigh at least 150lbs. (feels like 200lbs). not to mention the size of the board is huge...

just to old to carry that weight and some of the numbers and stuff are gone from age and corrosion... I can remember what they are but it would be nice to see them..

mainly some of the prices are so good these days I'd like to get a 20, 24 chnl mixer,,, the drums use 5 chnls right from the start...I want to use my non-powered spkrs to keep expenses down. do any of the new mixers allow me to just switch to powered spkrs later???

so want to hear from guys who have used these new cheaper mixers???

aloha, popoahi

Peavey, Yamaha, Yorkville Sound, those are my 3 recent choices.
Those are 3 brands that support you with schematics and parts, over the long haul.

I do not recommend Mackie or Behringer to anybody.
According to my own experience and that of others, the support for these products is very limited.
You will probably be disappointed with the support over a long period.

Buying products made in China may "seem like" a bargain...but later when things need parts or schematics, you may be completely out of luck.
I would never buy any sound equipment made in China....or from any company that does not stock and sell EVERY part...directly to customers.

Especially TRANSFORMERS.
We have seen several Mackie products go in the trash, because Mackie would not sell or stock the parts (transformers) to repair them.
So, an otherwise GOOD mixer, goes to the junk man.
Mixer, $1100 three years old, is now a boat anchor.
If we "would have" bought Peavey, we would have our parts in just a few days. Too bad they did not buy Peavey.

We have been told by Behringer Reps that they sell parts to customers....and this turned out to utter BS.
Behringer would not provide schematics or parts to any customer that we are aware of...
And therefore I would never buy a Behringer product.

[km6xz]

A mixer would be a better value if you are happy with your speakers and power amplifier. None of the small mixers are built as well as the old heavy Yamaha but they will also cost much less than your old did when new.
Some mixers have builtin effects but they will not be flanger, vibrato, chorus. Those are not for general PA use but they will have various styles of digital reverb and other time domain effects

I do not want to rain on your parade but sending 5 mic channels through a small mixer, power amp and speakers is asking for terrible sound, unusable vocals and constant clipping. You do not have enough power of driven surface area to reproduce drums louder than they already are direct from the kit. Vocals will not have any headroom left to get over the drums if they are mixed in at realistic level. Reproducing a kick at the same level that it is generating from stage un-amplified will make your weight concerns over "only" 150lbs of Yamaha mixer seem trivial. Power amps, bass bins, compressors and such are big, heavy and expensive to do justice to a drum kit. The problem mostly in two areas. For bottom, a large speaker array is needed, driven by their own power amps and fed by electronic cross-overs and those driven by compressor limiters. Vocals, with say 2:1 compression, would be no problem getting power and reasonably low distortion with your system but not when 95% of the energy is devoted to drums that do not need it for anything smaller than 300 seats. Only put the instruments that really need it through the pa unless it is designed from the start to support the whole band. A little guitar, and maybe low mids to upper range of keyboards plus the vocals will be enough to tax your system and still sound good with reasonable dynamics. Low keyboard fundamentals will sap the power also and should be designed from the beginning to accommodate the lower notes.

So before asking for equipment choices, how about describing the use: size of venues and number of people. Band composition. Style of music. Desired undistorted SPL at the center of the audience. Bandwidth needed to handle at the center of the audience. Weigh tolerance for handling and budget. Are you using a separate monitor?
The same sorts of questions would be asked if deciding on a concert system or a casual acoustic guitar/vocal dinner music gig, from a $300 to $3,000,000 rig. It gets heavier and more expensive the deeper(kick drum for example) that you need to reproduce.
For a casual rig for acoustic music and light weight, the low cost Behringer offer a lot of performance for the money but things get more complicated the most instruments that are added to the vocals if anything is to remain clean. To get the most use of the headroom you have, you will need compression but there again, there are some cheap units that work really well. Many use a gain cell chip from THAT Corporation that determines the real performance. Seeing 2 channel compressors with that one chip ranging in price from $100 to $1000, you can find some value bargains.
Unless you are playing large venues and need a large system, I would suggest reconsidering the attempt to put the drums through a small PA system if you really need to supply your own system.

[soundguruman]

Yes that is 100% correct.
Powered mixers don't have anywhere near enough power for a rock band.

AND you will just get a bunch of distortion, from peaking amplifiers.