Where to order velocity sensitive shaped multi touch screen display ?

[Juhn]

Hello.

I'm creating prototype of new instrument and looking for a manufacturer.
Do anybody knows where to order, company or manufacturer, who can create custom shaped velocity sensitive multi touch screen display /fingerboard?

This device is a synthesizer, midi controller, 3D point controller. With multi touch screen display /fingerboard, which is used both for playing and options, like controlling oscillators and other. This will work in standalone mode as synthesizer, using minimal of function, and together with software (DAW) as 3D point controller or Midi messages. This DAW have another type of audio synthesis, and have a graphical interface, and will use 3Dpoint messages instead of Midi, which is not flexible enough.

This synthesizer will be designed to play independently with 2 hands(like on piano), playing many melodies in same time(till 4), with a different sounds from stored soundset, complete arrangement with different sounds, that will turn playing to real-time, music live performance. This instrument will require advanced playing style, without strings, playing on multi touch screen fingerboard.

There is more detaled pictures on:
https://ch.pinterest.com/juhnirhyt/m...n-synthesizer/
with examples about, how sound from soundset can be assigned on fingerboard.

This instrument will use a part of codes, of graphical interface and audio synthesis of DAW, so that both DAW and synthesizer will work in same way.

[J M Fahey]

Easy, go to the " velocity sensitive shaped multi touch screen display" shop and order one.

Serious: do you have an idea of what you are asking for?

These very complex and specialized products are designed and made by established Companies with years of experience, huge financial backing, who are trying to put a new product on the Market.

Completely out of reach from us mere mortals.

Do you have the schematic?
The PCB design?
The CAD files needed for fabrication?
Have you written and debugged the necessary software?
Enough capital to order between 1000 and 10000 of them? (minimum order).

[J M Fahey]

Try:
https://www.interelectronix.com/cust...solutions.html

That said I would expect 1000 unit if you supply everything or 10000 units if they do all the design effort.

[Mick Bailey]

Outside of custom-sized rectangular panels, anything shaped as your design is going to be challenging. Manufacturers go for straightforward X-Y coordinates for ease of production. Many device prototypes are no-functioning 3-D designs with the finished look and feel, accompanied by convincing software simulations. This is done to get financial backing and interest to get to a functional prototype.

Edit: I re-read your post and you say you're creating a prototype - does this mean you're already building/fabricating a working design with the technical details all worked out? A company that has to do this for you will need to invest a lot of time and money to even get to that first stage. If it's just a conceptual design then you have a long way to go.

[Juhn]

Thank you Juan Manuel Fahey and Mick Bailey.

I found one company, who can create this shaped velocity sensitive multi touch screen (8-10 touch points) display /fingerboard.
They answered:

"To build a prototype of a touchscreen display that is not the typical rectangular shape, you would be looking at an NRE fee ($20,000) and a tooling fee (TBD)."

"As I mentioned, it would be NRE + tooling. Since a commercial display in this format doesn't exist, it would have to be custom-made. Custom tooling for displays can run upwards of $100-350k. For the rest of the assembly, there would be additional tooling costs (assembly fixtures, plastics/metals, etc), which can range from $20-100k depending on size and complexity.

In theory, we do have the ability to build the touchscreen display, but it wouldn't be feasible without volume and a large upfront investment."


It is possible to build this display.

I'm trying now to contact other companies, automotive display manufacturers, who allready creating shaped displays.

I'm looking for a manufacturer/ company, who want create new product, something really new. If I will not find this manufacturer, then I will try to create instrument myself.

[eschertron]

If it was my brainchild I'd split the idea into several independent functional stages (break the task into chunks), for example invent the synthesizer first and only then invent the user interface. Out of curiosity, what will this thing do that will make musicians want to take the time to learn a whole 'nuther instrument? Would it be better to fashion your synth into a more conventional design? What needs are you fulfilling?

[J M Fahey]

That.
Apparently so far it is just a conceptual idea.

Mind you, nothing wrong with that, not arguing the idea itself, but the effort/expense of actually building first a working prototype which requires a Ton of expensive tooling and design effort and then tooling up for any kind of production.

Can it be done? ... YES
You've been answered that so far.
Problem is the mind boggling investment.

Can Roland - Korg - Yamaha - Kawai and a couple other same caliber Companies make it?
Sure enough.
But then they will want to sell 100 - 500 - 1000 units a Month, or more.
Does such a Market exist?

You might reach them, who have the expertise and background and "sell them the idea"
If they like it, you can establish some kind of partnership.

[Mick Bailey]

I too would be looking toward instrument manufacturers who already have well-developed prototyping facilities, supply lines and much more. The display is only a single aspect of the whole concept and if, as a whole, it has some merit then you may get further than trying to develop this exclusively by yourself. At the very least you could discover any barriers to acceptance and learn from the experience. Apart from the display, there are design and production costs, tooling, etc. for the enclosure and many other parts that need to be specifically manufactured. These are specialized areas in their own right.

The problem to overcome is that a company that specializes in manufacturing displays is likely to be selling to the OE market and not selling a finished product to the public. That is, display manufacturers mainly just provide displays to other companies and are unlikely to be interested in a finished product.

A company that I have a good deal of time for is Seymour Powell. They have a lot of experience in industrial design, taking products from concept through to the finished article form razors to motorcycles, mobile phones and much more. It's worthwhile looking at how they (and others) approach the type of thing you're wanting to do. I have a phrase - the "Seymour-Powell moment". They said that an object has to make the person looking at it decide they have to own one within three seconds of seeing it. That's what they're good at and its worthwhile just studying their methods and looking back through the history of their product developments over the years.

[Juhn]

Thank you J M Fahey and Mick Bailey and eschertron.

J M Fahey
"Apparently so far it is just a conceptual idea."

Conceptual idea, which was tested with another instrument (some kind of midi guitar), which I had before. And before I started writing DAW, concept was tested using existing sequencers( started writing DAW, because sequencers do not allow you to do your own mathematical calculations)

"Can Roland - Korg - Yamaha - Kawai and a couple other same caliber Companies make it?
Sure enough.
But then they will want to sell 100 - 500 - 1000 units a Month, or more.
Does such a Market exist?

You might reach them, who have the expertise and background and "sell them the idea"
If they like it, you can establish some kind of partnership."

I already tried to contact most of about listed companies over support, but most of them is closed for ideas coming from outside of company. As one of them said
" Unfortunately, we are unable to assist you with this. Our R&D team have strict confidentiality and development guidelines and we cannot get involved in any external ideas which could conflict with anything already in the development stages.. "

It's doesn't work just reach them. It must be the right person to contact. How to reach this right person, who have "expertise and background"?
I'm searching now the way how to contact these companies directly to person responsible for company's brand.


Mick Bailey
"Apart from the display, there are design and production costs, tooling, etc. for the enclosure and many other parts that need to be specifically manufactured. These are specialized areas in their own right."

Apar from the display there is other parts that need to be specifically manufactured, but I expect these other parts will not be so difficult to build and not so expensive, compared to display.


"Seymour Powell"

Thanks. This company have a long list of clients, very known companies. Maybe it could be also solution (I allready searched for such companies, but didn't found. Now I have one)


"They said that an object has to make the person looking at it decide they have to own one within three seconds of seeing it."

I didn't succeed to create instrument design on this level, which allow person looking at it decide they have to own one within three seconds of seeing it. The software tools, that I'm using for graphic design of instrument, slow down the all process (any small changing of shape, curves lines, is very time expensive).


eschertron
"Would it be better to fashion your synth into a more conventional design?"

This design(of body of instrument) is not completely finished, and can be done better, and also used for limited edition. Display/fingerboard of instrument have dimension of electric guitar, can be mounted on any electric guitar body (it will look also, like any other electric guitar).

"what will this thing do that will make musicians want to take the time to learn a whole 'nuther instrumen"

This synthesizer designed to play independently with 2 hands(like on piano), playing many melodies in same time, like music band of 3-4 person.
Also will let you create your own musical instrument inside synthesizer(fretless, semitones, graphical or just something).
And other.

[J M Fahey]

A similar idea was tested in the 80s


they made 100 to "test the water"
Sadly they didn't sell.

[Mick Bailey]

One thing that immediately struck me with the design is that it looks like a sword, which is bound to polarize your audience. Or at least, invite unwanted attention at the airport. Given that the instrument design is not fixed, my own opinion is to not sell the idea on that basis and go for something neutral.

In terms of the overall concept and the individual unique selling points that go into it, what protection do you have for the instrument? It's important to consider the parasitic market; what would there be to stop another company from copying it and making it more cheaply? If anyone were to invest in this they would have to be reasonably assured that the device could be protected well enough to recover costs + profit. This could be through patents, design copyright, trademarks, protection of the code, etc,.

My own view of developing anything alone is that the financial risk could lead to a seriously large debt, unsold stock, idle or redundant tooling and wasted packaging. Large organizations can afford to write off unsuccessful products and walk away. I would be looking at least to secure a partnership on the basis of shared cost, shared risk, shared reward. Even so, the amount of investment by yourself is likely to be substantial. You've already seen just part of the cost of building a custom display.

Are you certain that there's no aspect of the design that could infringe on anyone else's intellectual property? You would not want to be in a situation where you get to an advanced stage and someone makes an adverse claim against you.

[Juhn]

J M Fahey

"A similar idea"

There is a many controllers (similar guitar controllers) like SynthAxe now, which you can buy right now.
If you want, can explain what is the difference between these instruments.



Mick Bailey

"it looks like a sword, which is bound to polarize your audience"

It is so. There is people who like this "sword shaped design ", but there is also who polarize and would be better go for something neutral.
The final shape of this limited edition of instrument, also, will not be the sword. Because this is not a sword, this is another thing.


J M Fahey

"Can Roland - Korg - Yamaha - Kawai and a couple other same caliber Companies make it?
Sure enough."


Do anybody know how to contact this above listed companies(not using company support), with company's general brand manager or senior engineer of company's research and development department (or somebody with high position) ?

[Juhn]

Mick Bailey

"Are you certain that there's no aspect of the design that could infringe on anyone else's intellectual property? You would not want to be in a situation where you get to an advanced stage and someone makes an adverse claim against you."

I'm certain.

[Juhn]

Example using electric guitar body shape.

[Juhn]

Another example using acrylic electric guitar body