Telecaster 4 way with slight twist

[TeleUser]

Hey folks,

I'm trying to wire up 4 way switch on a telecaster (2 single coils, vol and tone) but all the diagrams i find do the same type of wiring which is:
Position 1 - bridge
Position 2 - bridge and neck parallel
Position 3 - neck
Position 4 - bridge and neck series

Has anyone seen a diagram around that swaps the position 2 and 4 around? So position 2 = series and position 4 = parallel?

I've been looking around in all the usual places but couldn't find one... Let me know if you've seen one somewhere.

many thanks

[Steve A.]

I'll see if I can draw something up but I've used the 4 way switches in many teles and like how the bottom 3 positions are stock with a nice boost for position #4. (I usually wire the tone pot with a push-pull phase switch as the OOP series linkage is really slick!)

Steve A.

P.S. It should be a simple matter of just moving a jumper or two but I need to have a 4-way switch in my hand to figure out the specifics...

[bbsailor]

Steve A.

Here is a nice mod to what you just posted. Use a concentric stacked 500K volume pot but wired for independent control of each pickup. Now when the pickups are set to have two pickups on either in series or parallel, and the phase switch is set to out of phase, a slight turn of one volume pot will produce a nice tunable notch effect. All this stuff fits nicely on a Tele control plate.

I hope you and/or other forum members give it a try.

Joseph J. Rogowski

Thanks for the suggestion! I have a HH tele that I plan to rewire like that. I was looking into parts and it would cost around $40: ~$10 each for the pots which is reasonable plus ~$20 for the 4 knobs... ouch!

Fortunately I had picked up 2 pair of concentric knobs for an Ibanez bass on clearance at GC for $2.50@ about 10 years ago. I never used them because I didn't know where to find pots that would work with them. But these days the on-line sources are much better with very reasonable shipping charges. And the sellers often provide specs like the concentric shaft diameters.

As for the tunable notch effect you can accomplish that by adding a 1M trim pot to the DPDT phase switch: wire it between the normally grounded pickup lead and ground. You can then set it to whatever sounds best to you out-of-phase* (when in-phase the trim pot is out of the circuit.) You could drill a small hole in the control plate and glue the trim pot there for on-the-fly adjustments with the control plate in place.

AFAIK there are no dual concentric pots with P-P switching but there are two ways around that. There is usually enough room between the two tele pots to add a small DPDT mini-toggle for the phase switch. Or you could use a 5P4T mega switch intended for a strat.

They do make a mega switch these days with all of the contacts facing in that will fit a typical tele control compartment. Hooray! When I used a regular mega switch in a tele 15+ years ago I had to undercut the control compartment with a dremel tool to accommodate the "outie" terminals. Probably not the best choice for a vintage tele...

Steve A.

P.S. I'll add links to sources for the dual concentric pots and knobs if and when I find them again.

EDIT: Here is an eBay listing that looks great! $12.80 plus $9 s/h for two pots and 4 knobs (knurled chrome for teles!) Better yet get 4 pots for $25.60 plus $9 s/h...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/CHROME-DUAL...-/401375390903

[TeleUser]

Hey Steve,

Thanks for your help with this... I do agree, I think the #4 should be the 'boosted' one... I'm trying to convince my friend that will suit much better but ...

In any case, someone on another forum has made a diagram for me... so we're sorted.

Thanks for your input and willingness to help me out... that's very kind of you.

many thanks
J

[TeleUser]

Hey Steve,

Thanks for your help with this... I do agree, I think the #4 should be the 'boosted' one... I'm trying to convince my friend that will suit much better but ...

In any case, someone on another forum has made a diagram for me... so we're sorted.

Thanks for your input and willingness to help me out... that's very kind of you.

many thanks
J

[Steve A.]

Steve A.

Here is a nice mod to what you just posted. Use a concentric stacked 500K volume pot but wired for independent control of each pickup. Now when the pickups are set to have two pickups on either in series or parallel, and the phase switch is set to out of phase, a slight turn of one volume pot will produce a nice tunable notch effect. All this stuff fits nicely on a Tele control plate.

I hope you and/or other forum members give it a try.

Joseph J. Rogowski

Thanks for the suggestion! I have a HH tele that I plan to rewire like that. I was looking into parts and it would cost around $40: ~$10 each for the pots which is reasonable plus ~$20 for the 4 knobs... ouch!

Fortunately I had picked up 2 pair of concentric knobs for an Ibanez bass on clearance at GC for $2.50@ about 10 years ago. I never used them because I didn't know where to find pots that would work with them. But these days the on-line sources are much better with very reasonable shipping charges. And the sellers often provide specs like the concentric shaft diameters.

As for the tunable notch effect you can accomplish that by adding a 1M trim pot to the DPDT phase switch: wire it between the normally grounded pickup lead and ground. You can then set it to whatever sounds best to you out-of-phase (when in-phase the trim pot is out of the circuit.) You could drill a small hole in the control plate and glue the trim pot there for on-the-fly adjustments with the control plate in place.

AFAIK there are no dual concentric pots with P-P switching but there are two ways around that. There is usually enough room between the two tele pots to add a small DPDT mini-toggle for the phase switch. Or you could use a 5P4T mega switch intended for a strat.

They do make a mega switch these days with all of the contacts facing in that will fit a typical tele control compartment. Hooray! When I used a regular mega switch in a tele 15+ years ago I had to undercut the control compartment with a dremel tool to accommodate the "outie" terminals. Probably not the best choice for a vintage tele...

Steve A.

P.S. I'll add links to sources for the dual concentric pots and knobs if and when I find them again.

EDIT: Here is an eBay listing that looks great! $12.80 plus $9 s/h for two pots and 4 knobs (knurled chrome for teles!) Better yet get 4 pots for $25.60 plus $9 s/h***...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/CHROME-DUAL...-/401375390903

*** That is what I mean by reasonable shipping charges... it doesn't cost the seller any more in postage to send two sets of pots and knobs instead of one so there is no additional charge. (The seller is in Canada so the $9 s/h charge is fair.)

[Steve A.]

Hey Steve,

Thanks for your help with this... I do agree, I think the #4 should be the 'boosted' one... I'm trying to convince my friend that will suit much better but ...

In any case, someone on another forum has made a diagram for me... so we're sorted. Thanks for your input and willingness to help me out... that's very kind of you.

many thanks

J

Can you post the drawing here for future reference? Or post a link to the other forum*** if it is there?

There is one big advantage to the wiring your friend requested: you have the two strong lead positions right next to each other. (It might be even better for lead players if Pos #1 was the series linkage, #2 the bridge pickup, #3 the parallel linkage and #4 the neck pickup.)

One thing really cool about the 4 way switch is if you are playing at a venue which is not friendly to single coil pickups... assuming that the two tele pickups are RWRP with respect to each other you have two humcancelling linkages to get you through the night: series for lead and parallel for rhythm. Been there done that...

Steve A.

*** Would that be the Seymour Duncan forum??? Very helpful people there with great ideas! It was the SD forum that came up with the idea for Custom Custom and Custom 5 pickups by swapping the ceramic magnets with Alnico 2 and Alnico 5. That worked out so well that Seymour Duncan added them to their line of pickups. BTW the SD forum also came up with the idea of swapping coils between the Custom and 59 Neck so that you get one with Custom slug and 59 Neck screws and vice versa...

[bob p]

There is one big advantage to the wiring your friend requested: you have the two strong lead positions right next to each other. (It might be even better for lead players if Pos #1 was the series linkage, #2 the bridge pickup, #3 the parallel linkage and #4 the neck pickup.)

I have the Baja switch in one of my Tele and while I like the series connection I'm not too excited about the series linkage position being next to the neck pickup position. Tonally it makes no sense -- I think the sound of the guitar should be progressive as the switch is moved.

I'd much prefer if it were at the other end of the switch travel so that there was a logical progression in sound that follows the switch position. I never spent any time looking at the switch itself for potential modification, I just put it in and moved onto something else. If someone posted a diagram that moved the series position to #1 then I think I'd take the time to rewire my guitar. I don't think it makes sense at position 4.

If I had to do it all over again I think I'd just get a push-pull pot and leave the 3 way switch alone. I might do that with my other Tele.

[Steve A.]

If I had to do it all over again I think I'd just get a push-pull pot and leave the 3 way switch alone. I might do that with my other Tele.

A push-pull DPDT pot to switch between parallel and series linkages? I was drawing up such a switch for a LP and I seem to remember that it would mute the output when in the middle position.

On a tele one section of the switch would toggle between connecting the volume pot input to the selector switch or to the hot neck pickup lead. The other section would toggle between sending the other neck pickup lead to ground or to the hot bridge pickup lead. With the two hot pickup leads still connected to the selector switch there could be an interaction in the middle position... I'd have to sketch that out to be sure.

Steve A.

P.S. The series OOP linkage is worth the price of admission... you get something like an early 70's Frank Zappa-ish cocked wah sound!

P.P.S. With a bright bridge pickup and a darker neck pickup the stock 4-way switch wiring makes sense to me. However if the bridge pickup is thick with mids then the series linkage would make sense in Position #1. So whether or not Fender screwed the pooch on the 4-way switch wiring might depend on your tele, whether it is a traditional Nashville C&W picker or a rock guitar. Just saying...

[bbsailor]

A push-pull DPDT pot to switch between parallel and series linkages? I was drawing up such a switch for a LP and I seem to remember that it would mute the output when in the middle position.

On a tele one section of the switch would toggle between connecting the volume pot input to the selector switch or to the hot neck pickup lead. The other section would toggle between sending the other neck pickup lead to ground or to the hot bridge pickup lead. With the two hot pickup leads still connected to the selector switch there could be an interaction in the middle position... I'd have to sketch that out to be sure.

Steve A.


P.S. The series OOP linkage is worth the price of admission... you get something like an early 70's Frank Zappa-ish cocked wah sound!

P.P.S. With a bright bridge pickup and a darker neck pickup the stock 4-way switch wiring makes sense to me. However if the bridge pickup is thick with mids then the series linkage would make sense in Position #1. So whether or not Fender screwed the pooch on the 4-way switch wiring might depend on your tele, whether it is a traditional Nashville C&W picker or a rock guitar. Just saying...

Steve A. or anyone doing this mod,

See this: http://music-electronics-forum.com/t41300/ Post # 20 for details about how I did this mod. I did this mod for professional guitar players in the Atlantic City NJ area who like the wide range of sounds this mod gives them over the standard 3-way Telecaster switch system. More importantly, you do not need to cut any more holes in the Telecaster metal mounting plate. It is best to mount copper foil in the control compartment and overlap the copper foil over the two screw holes so that when the metal plate is mounted the entire control compartment is shielded. Unless you look very closely at the guitar, the only mod you will see is the stacked concentric volume controls to individually adjust each pickup. I find that using a high E .011 set of strings works best with this set up.

Joseph J. Rogowski

[bob p]

Great post. I was just thinking about using the Jazz Bass vol-vol pot.