technical difference between Peavey Classic 30 and Delta Blues

[tedmich]

Hi jared.
I guess you don't know the cost pyramid on *any* factory made product.
You seem to believe that a $50 increase in cost translates into a $50 increase in price payed by the customer over the counter.
Nothing further from the truth, in *any* industry.
An average factor may be 8x , such as to turn your $50 into a $400 difference, retail ............... and that hurts.
Now on what seems to irk you most: the "cheap particle board".
Plywood in its various forms is becoming less and less attractive, not only by the visible "price difference" that you quote, which I already told you becomes huge when it reaches the consumer, but because those big trees of yesteryear , easily available in the 50's, are all gone now.
New trees, even quick growth ones, are smaller diameter; "shaving" them to provide the basic thin sheet to make plywood provides much smaller sheets, more voids appear, the works.
You have less choice, woodworking becomes more complicated, plywood splits, you have more rejects, you have to sand it a lot.
Construction users, who have traditionally been heavy plywood buyers, had to accept much rougher plywood, OSB, and even "water proof chipboard".
Compare it to the new, improved , particle board materials: they have very fine grain, can come in any size, and have two huge advantages:can be made with new "any size" trees, but most important: being homogeneous and fine grain, can be cut, shaped and finished with automated, high production equipment.
That makes it possible for you to buy an excellent, very well made and sounding amplifier for 600 to 800 U$S retail.
Of course if you want a traditionally made one, you can pay U$S 3200, 3500 or more for a boutique amp.
Those prices allow "real plywood", "real tweed", alnico speakers, cloth covered wire, paper in oil caps, NOS tubes, the whole magic.
PS: I got into this thread thinking you were speaking about something *technical* .

well said, additionally particle board is actually preferred to plywood in speaker enclosures due to its homogeneous structure, higher density and its resultant ability to dampen cabinet resonances. We don't just need strength in a cabinet material. My PV Ultra 212 seems to have about 1.5lb of weight per watt of output. Concrete is even better but weight can become an issue...

I'll be starting the CF/Nomex honeycomb cabinet any day now...

[Steve Conner]

I believe I put too much currency into what so many other people were saying without relying on my own judgement and taste ( I shoudl klnow this as I am an avid cyclist and the same thing happens on cycling forums)

The same thing happens on all forums. Me thinks it's either human nature, or the nature of the kind of people who like forums at least.

I'm not too fond of particle board, OSB or MDF for guitar cabinets either, but Peavey have been in the business for a while and know how to make a solid product. If they make a business decision, I guess I have to respect it. Maybe you can get a local woodworker to make you a new cabinet out of French polished birdseye maple, and you transplant the guts in.

I'm also a keen mountain biker, but I ride to get away from forums.

[Jared Purdy]

that would border on eccentric!

If I was getting a boutique amp made, and that is in the cards, then yes, I would get a nice lookign solid wood, like flamed maple, or something like that. But to pull out the guts of the the C30, and then have someone make me a new cabinet, hmmm...not on my dime! I'm going to be checking out a local amp builder's product in a couple of weeks. He builds cabs to personal preferences, though most of the time he said that he uses 3/4" birch ply. He does have some photos of one or two beautiful cabinets that are made from some type of maple (flamed I think). They look like pieces of furniture! check him out at trinityamps.com. One thing that I will be interesting is hearing the C30 along side his (he makes several models in either 15 or18 watts). It'll either be a clear indictment for getting one of his made, or it'll be like, "well, yes they're really nice, but are they $1000 more nice?

[J M Fahey]

Hi jared.
Just by chance, (I was searching for something else), I came cross some guys that make beautiful cabinets, with high grade plywood, original Tolex or Tweed, convincing cloth, the works.
The prices were neither $100 nor $1000, they seemed to hover around $300/350.
Obviously they were for cloners, they had beautiful Twins, Bassmans, etc.
Maybe they even have one your size but if not, perhaps they could modify something slightly to accomodate your chassis and speakers.
Don't remember the links now, but I'm sure somebody around here knows what I'm talking about, or you can ask that fellow, that Mr Goog...something, don't remember well.
Sorry but lately don't remember where I left my memory pills.

[Jared Purdy]

thanks....

Hi, thanks for the tip!

The business that I mentioned in my previous post (trinityamps.com) will do a custom cabinet for around the same amount. Its unlikely that I'll go that route, at least in the interm, as I am still getting use to this amp. Generally, unless something is so bad, when we are playmg the same equipment all of the time, it sounds fine. Its only we we get it next to something else where we can compare, that we can really notice differences, good and bad.

When I compare this amp to one of the trinity amps, if this is really off base (though I am beginning to have my doubts about that), I will either get rid of it, or keep it and play around with swaping speakers, and yes, perhaps even changing the cabinet. However, I don't really believe that a cabinet change would net that much of a difference, especially at the price that you would have to pay (the law of diminsihing returns). Paying $50-$100 more for a better cab at the out set is a lot different that paying $350 (plus tax) after. A speaker, yes, but the cab is debateable.

[Glass Snuff]

Now that I think back, Peavey did make a solid cab for the C30. I think it was mahogany. It doubled the price, and didn't sell at all. Can't honestly say it sounded better, but it did look very nice. In a living room. Be scared to gig with it.

Since the C30 is prone to tube rattle, a more resonant cab is probably not a good idea.

[Jared Purdy]

tube rattle?

are current generation c30s prone to tube rattle, or is that more of a thing of the 90s?? I haven't detected that in mine (dec 09 purchase), though the tubes, or at least one of them went microphonic yesterday, which I was told is part and parcel of el84's

[Enzo]

That fancy C30 didn;t sell a lot becuase it was an extremely limited production. A lot more people wanted those than they made amps, by the way. If I recall they only made 1000 or something.

Ther rattle is the tubes, not the amp. Nothing to do with the age of the amp.

[Jared Purdy]

tube rattle...

Thanks Enzo, I think something just became clearer for me: when people talk about tube "rattle", they aren't talking about the tube physically rattling around in the socket, they are talking about micorphonics. Is that correct? I'd love a mahogany cab on my C30!

[Enzo]

Specifically it is the innards of the tube rattling against the inside of the glass.

If you hold an EL84 in front of your face - base pins on your thumb and the pointy to under your index finger - and rap on the side of it hard with your knuckle, you will often hear the insides rattle with each rap.

Microphonics refers to the tube acting like a microphone - tap on it, and it makes sound come out your speaker. Tubes that rattle may or may not be microphonic. Microphonic tubes may or may not rattle.

[Jared Purdy]

tube rattle...

Thanks Enzo,

Yes, once again, that is also what the technician at Steve's said (he asked me to tap the tube with a pencil but I couldn't fit one throught the grill). He also said that the rattle won't harm the amp, and said that some people just live with it. Well, if wasn't under warranty, or if I was broke I suppose I woudl have to! But that is not the case, and persnally I find it annoying! I'll be putting Groove tubes in as that is what the have in stock. That in itself will be an interesting experiment in terms of hearing difference they produce with the amp.

Regards

[Glass Snuff]

That fancy C30 didn;t sell a lot becuase it was an extremely limited production. A lot more people wanted those than they made amps, by the way. If I recall they only made 1000 or something.

Well, I wish one of those people had come by our store and bought the damn thing! We had to beg someone to take it for cost! (even then, it was expensive for a C30)

[Jared Purdy]

how much??

Do you remember what it cost??

[Glass Snuff]

Not really.... $749 sticks in my head. Back then, a C30 was about $399.

[old mark]

I found this old thread by accident, and registered so I could reply to it. I have been playing electric guitars and basses since 1964, getting paid for it for many years. I played strictly tube amps for several decades, various brands and types.
I own only Peavey amps now, and they are all older models...my newest amp is well over 20 years old. I LOVE Peavey stuff, but I recognize it may not be for everyone. If you really want "classic" build quality, shop around for an old Peavey amp. They are remarkably inexpensive and they are beyond reliable. I would not recommend "modding" an amp, especially a relatively new amp...there are a lot of people out there who make big money selling parts-improvements, fixes, upgrades, whatever...that are completely unnecessary and in some cases really bad ideas. It is much easier to tweak your guitar-set up the pickups, and yes, USE THE TONE CONTROL...They call them that because they can control the tone, you know...

OP, this is not aimed at you-I see people buying "upgrades" for brand new guitars they do not even own yet, and it drives me nuts. I used to work in a small guitar shop some years ago. Over the years I have pretty much found the sounds I like, and I know how to set up my instruments to suit my playing.
I hope by this late date your problems are resolved and even forgotten, and that you are enjoying your guitar and amp, which is what it is all about.

mark