doing business with local music shops

[StarryNight]

I have been approached by a local music store asking if i'd like to "do some work for them" regarding repairs and rewinding. I'm just wondering if anyone else has an arrangement with a local music store and if so, to what extent? Part of me feels it could be counter-productive: If I charge them my rate are they going to upcharge customers? If they advertise that they provide a rewind/repair service will that take direct business away from me? Could I not ask them to refer the customer directly to me? Do I give them a discount if they provide me with steady business? Are there other BtoB models out there? The majority of my business is local so I'm trying to get known and not be under-foot necessarily. Any input appreciated!

[FunkyKikuchiyo]

Before I did pickup work we outsourced all of our rewinds and pickup repairs that were more complicated than replacing leads, touching up solder joints, etc. and we didn't upcharge on the fee that we were charged. We did however charge OTHER fees, since if we were to send out a pickup to our rewinder, we typically had to take the instrument in, and basically perform the same labor as a pickup swap, so in that sense there was an upcharge. I would imagine that is how most techs would do it. Charge for the services you perform, mark up on things you actually sell, and just do a

I'd ask them up front. Simply tell them that you don't want them under selling you by having people bring stuff in to the store. Any reasonable business person will understand that completely, especially in the music business, and I don't think you'd need to be subtle about it. Getting business that way CAN save you time in the long run, since they deal with interfacing with the customers. Sometimes with repairs that can be half of your day, just hanging out at the front talking about string gauges and pot values. So, if you get less money it might be more than worth while if the volumes increase proportionately.

My guess is that you won't see a LOT of work coming from them. They probably just want to have you in the rolodex so that they can keep customers instead of just sending them off should they need a rewind. Moreover, I suspect it would be a different clientele that would go to them for the rewinds and someone who would seek out a winder themselves, so it may ultimately have no impact on your regular business.

We did send out other electronic repairs on which we did take a percentage, and honestly I felt like we still lost money. Again, it is all that time interfacing with the customer can sometimes be as much time as the actual work. Our techs tended to get pretty spoiled because they'd just have to pick up a car load of stuff, drive off, come back later and get money.

Thanks for the good topic!

[big_teee]

I have 2 local shops that I put Pickups in their show case on Consignment.
I reduce my price 15% . I let the shop make that. They have zero money invested.
The up side My Pickups get much more exposure in the music stores.
I have my business cards laying around their shops.
Lots of times customers will call you direct wanting to bypass the shop.
If they want a item that is in the shop I price it the same as the shop price.
That way no-one feels double crossed.
If it's work or an item that is not in the shop, I deal direct if I like.
I recieved several rewinds doing that.
If you are very well known I probably wouldn't bother.
If your unknown like I was, It really gets your name out there.
Good Luck,
Terry

[StarryNight]

excellent advice guys - thank you! Yeah, I don't suspect they will be a major stream of revenue. I just want to be proactive with any arrangement we may come to. I like the idea of consignment, but I've never done it before. Terry do you swing by once a month, replace what was sold and pickup the money? And yes, It's amazing how much time customers take up - good point! I enjoy the chatting but it does seriously cut into the day.

[belwar]

Here's the rule of thumb - Everyone needs to make some money in the deal. Either you're discounting, or they're upcharging.

I would suggest meeting in the middle. That way, they still make money, and people who search you individually out pay less. i.e. if you normally charge $200 for a rewind, charge the store $160. They in turn will offer the service for $220. Someone who searches you out will still get the deal at $200 and everyone feels good. Let me know the store name by PM and i'll tell you everything I know about them.

bel

[big_teee]

Yes I check in with them now and then.
Also One of the shops has their tech, that teaches music lessons, and plays in a local night spot.
If he wants any Pickups for his guitars, I sell to him at near my cost.
I fill his pockets with cards, and that generates business.
I'm retired so it don't take tons of business to keep me happy.
Several times I've had customers call me wanting something that was already in one of the shops. If I'm busy or don't have the parts, I urge them to buy the one in the shop already built, that I already have money invested in.
Terry

[RedHouse]

Yes I check in with them now and then.
Also One of the shops has their tech, that teaches music lessons, and plays in a local night spot.
If he wants any Pickups for his guitars, I sell to him at near my cost.
I fill his pockets with cards, and that generates business.
I'm retired so it don't take tons of business to keep me happy.
Several times I've had customers call me wanting something that was already in one of the shops. If I'm busy or don't have the parts, I urge them to buy the one in the shop already built, that I already have money invested in.
Terry

I'd say do it. Even if it's only for a while, they can help you gain some visibility while you help them meet their customer needs.

Many of the small "local" music stores in my area (except GC) have an in-house "tech" (and I do use that term loosely) that can rewind pickups, so they mostly fend-off any relationships I've approached them about.

But I have made some in-roads at two of the local Guitar Centers, not "officially" through proper channels but I've done deals with staff members who have passed my business cards on to potential clients. One staff member passed my card along to a guy that owns a recording studio in my area and now I do their amp repairs.

On the flip side, I went in to one store (cough, cough, American Music) to talk about doing pickups and amp repairs and such one day, and the guy say's to me "we don't rewind pickups" fair enough, so I ask him what he does when a customer has a pickup go bad in his favorite axe, he says "we just yank 'em and install new ones", so I asked him what if the customer has a vintage or unique instrument, he says "oh well, in that case we'd send it out for repair" so I offered him my card and to discuss a discount rate so he can retail the service, he wouldn't take my card but said "We'll call ya if we need ya"...nice.


Sometimes music store "people" close their minds to new ways to sell things so it's kind of cool you've got one asking you, I'd lock-in and see if it goes anywhere for ya.

[FunkyKikuchiyo]

On the flip side, I went in to one store (cough, cough, American Music) to talk about doing pickups and amp repairs and such one day, and the guy say's to me "we don't rewind pickups" fair enough, so I ask him what he does when a customer has a pickup go bad in his favorite axe, he says "we just yank 'em and install new ones", so I asked him what if the customer has a vintage or unique instrument, he says "oh well, in that case we'd send it out for repair" so I offered him my card and to discuss a discount rate so he can retail the service, he wouldn't take my card but said "We'll call ya if we need ya"...nice.

If I had to guess, they probably think that they need to have a high profile rewinder to do vintage stuff. It is also possible they just never see that stuff in their shop. I've worked in some cities where seeing a 70s strat was really rare, and in some cities where 50s, 60s and 70s gear was all over the place because that is just what people played - no one thought twice about it or even bothered calling it "vintage".

Plus one on the pseudo-techs... I did some research a while back about what repair services different stores will offer... lots will have an "on-site tech with many years experience" but they don't do fret dressings! So basically, it is a guy with a screw driver and maybe an allen set. The sad part is that they don't really seem to care or know the difference. The service side is what makes real music stores far superior to catalog stores, so why not embrace that?

[Rick Turner]

Jeez, how much pickup rewinding business is there? I never got any when I worked at Westwood Music for a two year stint. This is not like replacing tires...

Normal consignment commissions are 20% to 25%.

On repair work, you can set up a split. At Westwood, I worked on a sliding scale. The more I got done, the higher a percentage I got paid. It slid from 60% of the labor on up to 70%. I was making really good dough in 1989 and 1990...about a grand a week...and I was cranking out the work.

[Steve L]

If you are looking for business, I would do it.

I don't do pickup rewinds, just amp repairs. For me it is the only way to do business. I have worked through stores, probably a total of 15 or 20 of them over the past 30 years.

If you do good work, just name your price, get paid when you return the pickups and let them up-charge all they want. You do have to be reasonable and leave them some room, so maybe you will have to settle for a little less, but here are a few of the pros:

No storefront, so no rent or mortgage.
You get paid when you are done, not when the customer finally gets around to picking it up.
You don't have to talk with certain customers for hours about "that tone" and how they can get it.

I suppose if you are looking for recognition, it will take longer going through stores, however if you are good, word will definitely get around anyway. Trust me.

There are also pros to being on your own, however to each their own.

Steve

[Mark Hammer]

I suppose it would depend on what sort of transaction takes place. If the store is in Victoria, and you're out in the far end of Langford, and they gather all the work orders, write them up for you, affix them to the instrument, and organize them for when you make a weekly pick-up/drop-off trip, then they've done part of the job and deserve to take a cut. If the relationship is that they "have a guy" a short drive over, whose work they assure is top notch, refer all their customers there, and you have a sort of unstated obligation to take all work refered via that route, with pricing set on mutually agreable terms with the store, and effectively represent that store, then I say you keep it all since you are providing them a service. Your good work and service supports their reputation, so they owe you more than you might owe them.

[Rick Turner]

It's very difficult to do really good guitar repair and setup without having a direct relationship with the customer.

[siney]

Thanks for providing clarificaions on this business issue that may be helpful