About Jaguar pickups

[Mark Hammer]

No, Jaguar has NOT done a Yamaha/Mistubishi/Hyundai and branched out from cars to pickups. I mean the Fender type.

I picked up a coil-less Jaguar pickup from someone yesterday, and was hoping to resurrect it. It apparently comes with A5 polepieces, but I have A3s now also, and an assortment of wire from #40 thru #44 that I could use for rewinding. The Hunter book says A5, #42 formvar, and a coil DCR around 6.5k.

So what do these things sound like when done "right"? How does one best complement the "claw" structure? I'm not especially committed to using the same package all round, so are they better for one position (bridge, neck, middle) than another?

[jason lollar]

i dont remember seeing one with formvar- its always enamel. Dont overwind it because these sound fat already due to the claw- they are also prone to horrible shrieking microphonic feedback which comes entirely from the claw,When i make them- I think I am the only aftermarket guy that supplies the claw with the pickup- I pot the claw to the cover and it helps.

[big_teee]

i dont remember seeing one with formvar- its always enamel. Dont overwind it because these sound fat already due to the claw- they are also prone to horrible shrieking microphonic feedback which comes entirely from the claw,When i make them- I think I am the only aftermarket guy that supplies the claw with the pickup- I pot the claw to the cover and it helps.

I've never seen one before except for pictures.
Please explain the function of the claw!
Thanks in advance,
T

[FunkyKikuchiyo]

I don't know much about the pickups, but I will say that you should bear in mind that Jags are 24" scale - I can't imagine an overwound pickup or thick build wire sounding very good in that situation, but I'm shooting from the hip on that guess. That scale would certainly throw me off on how I *think* something will sound, so I imagine it would be a similar experience for you... That is, unless you plan on installing it into a different guitar.

[Mark Hammer]

The "claw"/polepiece arrangement is analogous to the magnet/slug arrangement in a P90, except backwards. In a P90, you have a conductive slug in the middle, and magnets extending outward from that to shape the sensing area from the polepieces/slug in the middle to the outer edge of the bar magnet at each side.

In the Jaguar, the "claw" is a magnetically conductive piece of channeling that comes up on each side of the pickup from the bottom. In this instance there are magnets in the pickup and their charge is extended to the side via their contact with the claw at the bottom of the pickup. What I was unaware of until yesterday, was that the 6 claws on each side of the pickup are not uniform. The guy I bought it from informed me that the lower altitude claws were for the bass side.

And yeah, I think Jason is definitely onto something. I haven't even wound it yet, and clearly the risk of being microphonic is high unless there is a nice big gob of wax in there to damp any vibration of the claw assembly. It is held to the structure purely by magnetism. In that respect, think of it as a VERY big iron whisker the magnet has attracted. You REALLY don't want that thing vibrating.

[Mark Hammer]

I was thinking of making myself a Danelectro-style Vox Domino this coming summer. So, no particular tonal needs or expectations. If I don't like what I've wound, then I just unwind, or toss the coil and start again.

[jason lollar]

the short scale doesnt help either. Even though there are holes under each pole piece on the claw it does bring the polarity of the magnet on the bottom of the pickup up around the sides so you have south at the poles (rod magnets) in the middle and north on each side of the coil like alot of older pickup designs that had external magnets located on each long side of the coil- there are many examples but they are still somewhat obscure. So one effect of the claw is making the magnetic field wider- i suppose this might have a more complex way of working with the coil- I dont know- but the effect is easy to hear if you try it

[big_teee]

So I know winders have tried it with and without the claw, like running a tele bridge with and without the baseplate.
I guess the claw gives a tone you don't get with the regular strat single coil.
I wonder what inspired the 24 inch scale. I think of a rondo SX kid guitar when I see 24 inch scale mentioned! lol
Thanks Mark for the explanation!
I keep thinking I've seen most of the old designs, and then someone springs something else.
T

[verhoevenc]

If the claw is JUST held on by magnetism... wouldn't you be worried about any little bump (heck, even as early as cleaning excess wax off the visible surfaces) knocking it slightly off and therefore making it so that it's no longer held perfectly by the wax, and thus bringing about the feedback again? Maybe I'm over thinking it... but it seems once the wax dried and the claw was knocked you'd have an imperfect attachment again.
Chris

[ken]

I had two Jags once - a beautiful 1964 and a buttugly clownburst 1965 - and I could never figure out how to make the pickup stop squealing. The pickups sounded alright but were pretty unstable at any 'real' volume too.

The very short scale would seem 'kid sized' but it was really Fender's top of the line at the time. I think the claws were for shielding as well as an attempt to warm up the pickup a bit to counterbalance the Jag's boingy sound

If any of you see a sunburst 1964 Jag with the serial number L42765, tell it I said Hi... it was my first 'real' guitar.

ken

[FunkyKikuchiyo]

"boingy" might be the best term I've ever heard for 24" scale guitars... thanks Ken!

[Mark Hammer]

The claw is physically constrained (albeit not to very tight tolerances) on three sides. Yes, it is held in place by the magnets, but it also fits relatively flush against the outside of the cover.

I'm thinking that a bit of masking tape attached to the inside surface of the claw sides (i.e., the part you don't see), and a suitable application of wax on the bottom surface that adheres to the flatwork, will do a respectable job of damping any risk of vibration-induced microphonics that I might pose. I'm not the sort who stands in front of an 8 x 12" 100W stack, so that oughta be enough, assuming the coil itself is suitably potted.

As for boing-ey guitars, Fender has a proud history of a bunch of them besides the Jags, including anything that ever had a Mustang-shaped body.

Has the Jaguar pickup ever shown up on anything Fender made with a long scale?

[jonson]

Apart from the very early ones it was the standard pickup on the 30in scale Fender VI bass. Worked great with full size strings rather than the baritone set. I had 16 of them at one time all with heavy gauge string sets. Listen to the early Cream stuff as Jack Bruce got a good sound. Just sold my old Jag and that sounded shite.

[jason lollar]

no I dont do sloppy work- 99% of the time youll not find any trace of wax once its wiped off- occasionally maybe youll see a dull spot on the chrome underneath but you wont bang it off unless you drop it on the floor really hard because it fits so tight- you would have to see one to get it. Also I vacumm pot these so that makes a better seal.
You will be suprised how microphonic they are- Im not talking 100 watt amps with stacks- a super reverb or a blonde bassman etc will easily start to make them shriek turned up around 4 or 5. You can still control it there but get much louder or add some overdrive and your done- i get guys calling me all the time about microphonics on these because some indie rockers use jags and apparantly overdrive the crap out of them- I cant imagine how unless they take the claws off.
They used them on the pedal steel guitars in the late 60's and 70's and those guys really bitch because when they work the pedals it makes all kinds of racket- I usually tell those guys they will have to take the claws off- invariably if they do it turns it into what they consider useable although it does change the tone.

[ken]

The Achilles' heel of the Jag pickup IMO is the way the claw mounts to the pickup.

I think the only way to make a good quiet Jag pickup is to 'triple wax pot' it. First pot the pickup, then put the pickup in a cover full of wax, then add the claw and dunk 'er again. You will either end up with a nonmicrophonic Jag pickup or a really weirdo looking candle.

FunkyKikuchiyo

"boingy" might be the best term I've ever heard for 24" scale guitars... thanks Ken!

Actually, IMO the only way the Jag pickup sounds good is with a 12-54 string set. Just ask me... I tried to set my '64 up with a DM 9-46 string set and I thought I broke it. The Jag's sound with light strings actually reminded me of one of those 'jew's harp' things that I saw Snoopy play in a Peanuts cartoon once.

The guitar actually needs the added mass of the 12-54 strings to have any kind of bass response at all.

What was Leo thinking???

ken

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