Japan PAF's fetch $600 easy ( Dry Z's by Greco)

[pupoholic]

BAD NEWS ---
http://www.tokaiforum.com/viewtopic....ht=dry&start=0

I MAY HAVE JUST paid $525.00 for FAKES???

read the thread above -

I can't post at Tokia forums - cause I Can't seem to get a email back with a password.

if your a member please post that Don Mare Pickups bought those Dry Zs and
would like to hear from them what to check to see if these are actually real or FAKE.. shucks!!!!!!!!!

heres the ones I bought - buyer states 100% real and original solder joints
http://cgi.ebay.com/Greco-Z-dry-pick...QQcmdZViewItem

[Possum]

...

Why don't you send that link to the seller and talk to him direct that way first before jumping the gun. I've seen some people just get super critical about every tiny detail on vintage stuff and more often than not they're wrong. It sounds like he is a reputable seller, that one guy said he's only had good stuff from him. If no one else is a member here, maybe someone has time to register and forward you message, or try emailing the the forum webmaster or something. Its saturday and often some forums don't do business on the weekends. Don't freak out....

[David Schwab]

You know, there's one thing I didn't consider, and that probably some of you are using inexpensive PC's to listen to YouTube, I have noticed one or two guys comment in the messages area that they thought they were having problems with the sound quality on their cheap PC's and supplied speakers. I'm using a G5 Mac and powered Yamaha speakers on comcast broadband, the sound quality I get off YouTube is pretty decent, its not perfect FM quality but I enjoy listening to tons of stuff on there and have no problem figuring out what other pickup makers work sounds like, or historic videos etc. I don't have any complaints but not everyone has a $3500 computer either
Maybe the Google thing is a good idea, mostly searches in it bring up YouTube content anyway, but its free so may dump all my videos over there too

Your videos sound great. I'm also on a Mac, a G4 DigitalAudio with Monsoon planar speakers, and a sub woofer, and also I use some nice AKG headphones. My Mac has an M-Audio Audiophile 2496 sound card that runs to a Behringer mixer and then to the Monsoons. My Mac doubles as my stereo system.

But a lot of the videos on YouTube sound like crap, even the music videos.

[Possum]

quick PC sound test...

I hooked up our dusty Fujitsu laptop here, not a cheapie, and plugged it into my computer speakers and play Peter Green youtube through both computers, the Mac definitely has better sound, not a whole lot but noticeable. So, there's that :-)

[pupoholic]

Why don't you send that link to the seller and talk to him direct that way first before jumping the gun. I've seen some people just get super critical about every tiny detail on vintage stuff and more often than not they're wrong. It sounds like he is a reputable seller, that one guy said he's only had good stuff from him. If no one else is a member here, maybe someone has time to register and forward you message, or try emailing the the forum webmaster or something. Its saturday and often some forums don't do business on the weekends. Don't freak out....

yea i did, thanks

heres his reply -- seems genuine!

Hi Don,



You should not afraid of that?The Z-dry you bought is 100% original !!!

It is from my collection as I mentioned(only 3 sets left)?and is removed from my EGF-1200(one owner).

Unfortunately, there are some people attack me?

Please consider, in order to make fake D-dry pickup, It will cost too much, and when you hear the sound, you understand it is original Z-dry.



Best regards,

Hirotaka

[David Schwab]

BAD NEWS ---
http://www.tokaiforum.com/viewtopic....ht=dry&start=0

I MAY HAVE JUST paid $525.00 for FAKES???

Geeze... I just looked at the auction photos... I have or had some of these pickups! Unfortunately I lost a box of parts when we moved last... Hope these weren't in that box. But I recognize the Z on the bottom, as well as the label and the 201 stamp.

I actually found a humbucker one day that I thought was one of these, and it was a Gibson Shaw, that my friend then bought from me.

I have to go look for those Greco pickups tomorrow!

If it's any consolation, the ones in the photo look EXACTLY like the ones I have. I can't even remember what they came out of.

[dai h.]

Yeah, that guy is using a couple Fender amps, this is precisely why you need to listen to alot of different examples of real PAFs, the amps themselves really color their tone. You may actually find you dont like PAFs once you discover what they are really like.
Here's Peter Green's bridge pickup only through an Orange amp, one of my favorite clips:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxux5LdmjQU
Here's another one, both guitars are bursts:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JsVmsPv6_Ic

The bridge pickups often have a noticeable resonant peak and you can hear it in the second clip where they aren't playing very loud. I'll try to get my list of clips together tonite and post them in a seperate thread maybe.....

thanks. It really helps to have audio samples as I'm trying to get some sort of reference in my head what they are supposed to sound like. Lot easier to tell the difference than the clips used on the Duncan site, IMO.

as for the Dry Zs, I vaguely remember them being advertised in Japanese gtr. mags but don't know much about them otherwise. Clearly they seem to have a premium just from looking at a couple of finished auctions though $600 seems a lot but maybe they are worth it(?).

Greco with two Dry Zs (auction finished about $473--the seller claims to have bought the installed DryZs used for about $371 ea.) :

http://209.85.175.104/search?q=cache...BE%A1%E6%A0%BC


two Dry Zs only (auction ends about $205) :

http://209.85.175.104/search?q=cache...BE%A1%E6%A0%BC

single PU, no picture (ends about $176--"removed from ca. '81 Greco gtr.") :

http://209.85.175.104/search?q=cache...BE%A1%E6%A0%BC

[pupoholic]

Hello- the Dry Z's came today US Mail - signature required from Japan _

they're A-OK

Not messed with or altered - they checked out to be - unsoldered - and the shiny screws are original and have never been pulled out -

Put them in the Greco Les Paul -

They sound better then the Duncans here and better then the Dimarzios.

they're pretty much that PAF tone -- just a little more direct and smooth?
but almost perfect..

so there no Holy Grail - "just good" and better then whats being put out by the big corps..

nothing to write home about - but a darn fine tool..

so heres the problem I have now,

because they were never unsoldered or tweaked with... I had better just leave them that way.. they add lots of Value to my Greco EGF1000 - making it a EGF1200 or 1800 model -

so I will not be pulling them apart and looking at what makes them tic.
Like Dave said - "its just a Copy" best to look inside Real PAF's - my frined has a pair or two and offered to let me measure the coils - unsoldering the 2-coils a little - just enough to grab the DCs on each.

so - moral of the story is - are the Greco Dry-z's woth 500 to 800 on their own merit -- answer - NO WAY!
but they're worth it for restoration or adding value like I just did -

my total investment is now $1,200 a EGF1200/1800 starts a $2,000 and goes up.. so I'm going to hold tight -
I'll I require of my Les Paul is to sound allot like Jimmy Pages - and to me it does a pretty good job.. so its all done..

Don

[Possum]

...

So how about doing some sound clips of them. Couldn't find any good ones on YouTube...

[archtop]

sound clips

http://music-electronics-forum.com/s...ead.php?t=6785

[pupoholic]

BTW Sunday the 10th these Dry-Boys -- welp~they really kicked major PAF as`s at the gig - OMG!!!!!!!

[SteveJ]

There are several middle of the road and high end Japanese manufactured pickups that sound as good as real PAF's. Most of them I suspect were made by Maxon but maybe not all. I know they were able to pull it off as late as 1985 so the materials used were available up until then. I have compared the 1985 set of pickups that I have to the PAF's in an original 58 LP and they were dead on. Mine are low output but will knock down a wall. Unfortunately mine have no numbers or markings to allow me to identify them other than they were stock Greco. I also have a couple of other sets from earlier years. I don't know what wire was used but it does not have the purple tint. IMHO the myth about wire is out the window. Nothing special that I can tell about the bobbins. My bet is it's in the steel and of coarse the magnets have a big effect. The Japanese could nail it through the late 70's to mid 80's. Not only the Dry Z's but the PU-2 and others sound good. The Screamin' 82 is decent with a magnet swap. Stock mag is ceramic in the Screamin'. My best set measure at 7K DC resistance. When I roll back on the volume pot I can get that Fender like tone and still retain a nice full tone, doesn't get thin.

Most important is you have to play through a good vintage tube type amp to get the most of PAF's. I took my guitar to a friends house and wanted to show him what it sounded like. I played through two of his amps and it sounded ordinary. I build my amps and when I plug into a Marshall or Trainwreck style amp I can nail those classic tones. Plenty of honk, double notes, harmonics and lots of air. I have tried a lot of boutique pickups and I haven't found anything to come close yet. Unfortunately there are a couple pickup makers here that I haven't had the opportunity to check out their product yet but hopefully sometime I will get too. Anyway my point is that you can trust me on this. They are worth taking a look at.

[Possum]

...

I wouldn't totally discount the magnet wire as part of the formula. I saved off the wire from a PAF slug coil I got on Ebay and even though the diameter is the same as what I can get now, I think the insulation is way different. In talking to some who've played a fair amount of bursts it sounds like '59-'62 something in those pickups was different than earlier versions.

I was kinda wondering if those were ceramics in the DryZ, they obviously hit some combination that makes it work...

[pupoholic]

I was kinda wondering if those were ceramics in the DryZ

yea mine are ceramic ---











































not

[Possum]

....

HA! So, you did take them apart?
There is an unwarranted bias against ceramic magnets, I have two types of tele blade pickups and I never tell the players they're ceramic powered and they love them. Maybe I should tell them its black alnico